An Asian American Viewpoint On China, Tibet and the Olympics
April 6, 2008
It’s yet unclear whether the tumult over China, Tibet and the Olympics will ever reach a crescendo. San Francisco’s Board of Supervisors, however, could not help but join the fray by calling for a boycott of the 2008 Olympics opening ceremonies and by protesting the passage of the ceremonial Olympic torch through San Francisco on April 9.
The issue is not that the City is meddling inappropriately in global affairs. San Francisco prides itself as being the gateway to the Pacific. The United Nations was founded here with good reason. And it was the Chinese Olympics Committee that chose San Francisco as the only U.S. host city for the Olympic torch relay.
The issue is that this San Francisco grandstanding is based on pure ignorance — ignorance of the views of these politicians’ own Chinese American constituencies, and ignorance of the real and complicated economic, cultural and political forces at work in China and the Tibetan region.
As Yoichi Shimatsu comments in this week’s issue, it is not just Buddhists and democracy that are causing unrest in Tibet. There is a mix of religions and ethnicities with Muslims, Mongols and others involved, as well as dire ramifications from the spread of Western-initiated globalization. The complexities of China mean that 70 percent of China’s residents still live in poverty, but the 350 million people that makeup China’s middle class is greater than the entire population of America.
By oversimplifying the issues, San Francisco supervisors are practicing the politics of divisiveness. They are turning the Tibet issue into one that is “either/or.” Either we must support the call for democracy in Tibet, or we are not being true to America’s ideals — even worse, we get labeled as politically incorrect. It is the same kind of demagoguery that was used to whip the American public into a war furor over Iraq.
Here at home, these actions feed an undercurrent of anti-Chinese sentiment that all too often spills over onto Chinese Americans and, more generally, against all Asian Americans. The FBI is already asking Chinese Americans to effectively spy on each other.
It’s not so surprising that the Chinese American community has remained largely silent in the face of all the sound and fury. The nearly all white Board of Supervisors simply doesn’t represent Chinese Americans or Asian Americans in San Francisco. It’s as if the community is saying, “No need to waste our voices on deaf ears.”
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126 Responses to “An Asian American Viewpoint On China, Tibet and the Olympics”
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There is no “undercurrent of anti-Chinese sentiment” in most of the U.S. I am from the midwest, and have traveled the world for decades. If anything, most of the poeple I have lived and work with respect Asian Americans, and Asians in general as extremely hard-working, disciplined and goal-driven to improve their lives and communities. I think most Asians are an inspiration to others in the U.S. and have simply never seen animosity or racism towards Asian people that one might see towards other ethnicities. But I will also say that any animosity or resentment you are seeing is directed solely at the strong-arm tactics of the Chinese government. Americans feel deeply about any government that would repress or hold-back the desire of people to be more “free” and to march towards democracry. That is woven into the fabric of who we are as a nation- please do not mistake that for anti-Asian sentiment, because it is not. It is anti-communist, and anti-repression sentiment. It just so happens that the Chinese government is crushing Tibet, and hosting the Olympics. The news and opinion will become much stronger in the months ahead most likely.
Best regards-
Many Western politicians, always against their conscience to expand some of the events to get their own political purposes, many credibale news organizations have lost the appeal of the Chinese people.
An Anglo American Viewpoint On China, Tibet and the Olympics: The Dalai Lama is a master of passive-agressivity. “His Holiness” pretends innocence in perpetrating the quite timely outbreak of global protests and violence aimed at shaming China. We Americans who live in a glass house (Gitmo, torture, corporate war crimes, invasion of Iraq) have NO business throwing stones at ANY other nation. Whenever the western media reflects on Tibet the only invasion they ever mention is 1949, when Mao reclaimed the region as part of China, but no mention is EVER made of the brutal invasion of Tibetan China by the British in 1904. We Americans need to become global citizens once again, finding ways to open communications and increase our knowledge of other cultures… and what better time than during the Olympic Games in 2008. Instead we have Dalai Lama followers grabbing the spotlight, never once mentioning that under the monks rule the Tibetan people were dominated and suppressed under a social order that was far more cruel and reactionary than serfdom in Europe in the Middle Ages. During the era of the Dalai Lama there were no public schools or universities in Tibet. Tibetan women and girls were considered second class citizens and had no opportunity for education. Today, all Tibetan children, both boys and girls, have equal rights to a free and compulsory public school education. It’s time for us Americans to crack a book and do our own homework before deciding to speak out loud.
I trace back your well done article on Dalai Lama plotting the murder of the leader of the Karma Kagyu sects in 1977, to bring all these sects under the domination of Dalai Lama’s Geluk sect.
Asiaweek reported in Oct. 2000:
—Long-uneasy relations between the Geluk and Karma Kagyu sects were further strained by the Dalai Lama’s intervention in the recognition of the Karmapa Lama. It revived bitter memories of the 1960s, when the Dalai’s brother Gyalo Thondup tried to bring all Tibetan sects under Geluk control by force if necessary. When 14 exile settlements united to fight his plan, unrest erupted within the community. In March 1977, settlements leader Gungthang Tsultrim was shot several times at point-blank range. The murderer said he received 300,000 rupees from the Tibetan government-in-exile. He claimed it offered to pay him even more to kill the 16th Karmapa Lama (the current Karmapa is the 17th Karmapa He is only 16 years old).
It is fashionable to support Tibet cause now. Do you know there is Chinese version of affirmative action for Tibetans, they are not subjected to “one child” policy, can get into colleges with lower entrance exam score, etc? I live in us and know many white folks resent the affirmative action toward minority here. No country government will tolerate beating, looting burning killing, after Rodney King verdict, the black start looting, burning in L.A, Mr. King did received illegal treatment, was that justify all the looting, beating and killing, did George H. Bush call national guard to restore order in L.A.? When you use different standard you just lose your credbility.
Chinese Americans should unite and speak loudly against the injustice done by the San Fransisco’s board of Supervisors. Otherwise, we Chinese Americans will be targeted as Dr. Wenhe Li by a few white people with dark motives in the future.
As a True American, we must keep america #1. The part of the world that develops, is the part that keeps stable and thus invites investment. China learn this well. They have been fairly stable for far too long and thus could be powerful if nothing happens to trip it up.
Americas high standard of living compare to the rest of the world is base soley on creating instability outside. We can play the good guy on the surface so long as we are winning the game. But if we are losing, get ready to meet the real ugly American.
For China, now is the time to create instability before it’s too late. We try to make the yuan gain rapidly, but that didn’t work yet. America does not want a strong yuan, we want an unstable yuan. A yuan that goes sky high one day and comes crashing down the next day and thus the bubble.
Our next move is using ethnic diversity to bring down the government. The least we can do is create some instability. We are against China, not because it is a communist country or a dictator, we are against China because it is growing too strong too quickly and have the potential to unseat us as the ruler of the whole world.
We will do whatever it takes to keep America #1. We will scream human rights all day when it suits us. Humans are the best weapons for creating instability.
Go America Go, we are #1. Ha Ha.
What is so dramatically ignorant about this article is that it assumes that Chinese Americans somehow represent the views of Tibetans, and that our politicians should represent Chinese American views, and not basic human rights. Written within this article is that Tibet is in fact Chinese. This acceptance of Chinese propaganda is entirely the kind of ignorance that our politicians would be wise to reject, and what we should expect of them.
It is not ‘fashionable’ to disable, abuse, torture, tear children from their homes or parents, parents from their children, human beings from their countries, harvest organs and tissues of any human being, any age, anywhere on the globe. As a disabled voice for local/global understandings, it is probable that the mainstay of our voices who number probably in many, many, millions, with lesser connect in communication because lack of monies, disabled needs, etc., and many other needs of disabled communities, and individuals, prevents the main stay of our voices or persons to be represented equally.
Even though we may have lesser, or have only one day to live, we are emphatically against what is presently transping in Darur as the genocide, the abuses, torture, destruction of Temples, peoples, families in Tibet, the Falon Gong being murdered while they are alive and being systemitically measured to fit the needs of a living person needful of any type of organ transplant, then killing the host for their one or many organs, etc, to the Burmese and the on going killings, abuse, torture of thier citizens , The Ughyars as well wittnessing and confirming deaths, destruction, torture, abuse violations, and many others under Communist domination.
So, cite whatever it is you feel is objectionable, but it remains to date that The Chinese Communists remain with the highest human rights violations in this century!
All i can say for sure, is, boycott the Communist Chinese Olympic Openings, (support the athletes) but for sure, phooey on the Communist Chinese. They are an assured role model for all nitwits, and control freaks wanting top title of “little red monstors from hell”. They create fear and trepidation wherever they go, and are the least country to date chosen for holding the Olympics in their country, who hold the least respect for global confidence, or that of peoples with conscience. We are not complaining because of one life killed, we are revulsed by the knowledge of over 100,000 peoples have been murdered through genocide, abuse, extremes of torture, starvation, and outright murder.
Wake up and realize at least the horror of harvesting organs and tissues of victims while they are still alive. This is done not by medical personnel, but butchers from hell.
We are talking about human beings, objects. Human Rights belong to everyone, everywhere !
Tatiana
The word Communism seems to always represent evil. I came from a Communist country that was really evil. However Communist by theory is actual partially, practiced here in America. Communism deals with community rights versus Democracy for individual rights. When you live in a deed restricted neighborhood, you lived in a communist community. Your rights are bound to whats best for the community. When you can’t play loud music at night, thats communist, so the community can sleep. My point is communism is not so bad, unless it is combine with dictatorship and power gets abused. So is China a dictator? In the American mind, again the Chinese government is a dictator. I don’t think that it is a dictator now. For one, they have term limits. Their leaders are elected the same way corporate America elects our leader. They have a powerful 9 member politburo that balance the power of the president, much the same way as a board of director. There leaders are appointed base on proven leadership skills by someone on the inside who knows whats going on. Some local officials are elected by the people. Here in the US, we elect a president base on looks, talks, and promises. I don’t neccessary think its a stronger system.
The one who is able to fool the voters the best wins. I am not anti-america, but I think we need to stop imposing our systems and standards on other country. It’s arrogant and it can come back.
I am an Asian American. I believe Tibet’s issue is an internal issue between the Chinese government and Tibetans. It is China’s civic war or civic problem, we as American or anybody, should leave them alone and let them take care of their problems and concerns. I am an ethnic Chinese American, not born in China and only been there once. I respect human rights. If the Tibetans are being hurted by Chinese government or people in a riot or unfair war treatment, we as global citizens may voice our opinion in it.
Same as our minority or civic inequality or integration in this country. China never dares to intervent our business. It is our internal problem. Therefore, don’t waste your time talking about Tibetans. We might better of doing something worthwhile such as volunteering, donating, setting up non-profit organzations to help the unfortunates.
We can’t even solve our own problem here at home. Why worry others. Speaking for myself and my community. We are still lacking the representation of sport, music, entertainment, government, social or civic leaders, public figures, high level position in various employment sectors. We are still living as second class citizen working either as tech, labor, or regular citizen job. We can’t even break into the glass ceiling positions such as board, executive, management, advisor.
We need an Asian Pacific Candidancy as president. We wait too long to be invisible citizen in this country. I think when the olympic comes, we as Asian American needs to rise above crow and be American citzen like everybody else.
The Tibetan people suffered during the Cultural Revolution, and this wouldn’t have happened if the Beijing regime hadn’t intruded upon them. That’s all we need to know, no “complicated economic, cultural and political forces” can excuse that, or excuse the slaughter in Tienanmen Square in 1989, or excuse the intrusion of the Beijing regime on the First Amendment rights of the Tibetans, the Uighurs, and, indeed, the Han Chinese as well. So the support for an Olympic boycott doesn’t stem from “ignorance”; instead, it is based on “eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man”.
The recent events in Tibet are just an American-style race riot. Han Chinese- and Hui Muslim-owned shops in Tibet were smashed by ethnic Tibetans, reminiscent of the Rodney King riots when Afro-American rioters smashed white- and Korean-owned businesses in LA. In both situations it is a matter of a socioeconomically disadvantaged race venting their frustration, both justly and unjustly, against socioeconomically dominant races.
As an American-born Chinese, I say “knock it off.” You’d rather not say anything about the Tibetan massacre because of your perception here in the US? That is the most juvenile thing I’ve heard in a while. That’s like saying an American living in France opposes the French local officials opposing the Iraq war because it brings on “Anti-American sentiment.”
As for your statement, “The FBI is already asking Chinese Americans to effectively spy on each other” post references please.
I agree that many people are jumping on the “save Tibet” bandwagon more because it’s popular and they want to show their love for human rights. Seriously, how many people out there really do know what’s going on in Tibet, outside of what the Western Media is giving them? There has already been evidence of western propaganda with the cropping of pictures and incorrect captions from CNN and the Washington Post. Beside that, China has spent millions of dollars on Tibet to improve roads and education and public services. It was not quite like that back in the times of the Dalai Lama.
The US is not the most well-liked country in the world, and Americans should want to communications and knowledge of other countries. What better way than the Olympics?
I respectfully submit that it is our moral obligation to send three messages simultaneously on Wednesday when the Olympic Torch passes through our city.
First, we must send the message that we respect the dignity of every person. This includes Tibetans, Chinese, Chinese Americans, athletes in the Olympics from around the world and, as Mayor Newsom has stated, folks carrying the torch on their feet or in wheel chairs. As a white San Franciscan, I am so proud of the achievements of my Asian American brothers and sisters who have contributed to this city in spite of enduring racism and discrimination. I appreciate the words of Attorney Edward Liu (SF Chronicle, 4/6/08) who reminds us that a third of us are Asians. It is crucial that those of us who are not Asian make clear that our protest is not against the Chinese people or Chinese Americans. Given the human rights abuses committed by whites on Chinese Americans since the earliest days of San Francisco, I completely understand if my words are met with skepticism. My response is to respond sincerely that Asians and Asian cultures are an important factor in making this town a place I love.
However, I feel we must peacefully but forcefully speak out on behalf of all those who have suffered human rights abuses throughout the world. This has been a life long commitment of mine since joining Amnesty International at age 19. So, the second message we must send on Wednesday is righteous (but not self-righteous!) indignation: we must deplore the human rights abuses committed by the Chinese government both in Tibet and throughout China. Yes, I agree: the US and many other countries are guilty of human rights violations — I protest against these abuses as well as I can. But we must not fail on Wednesday to speak out on behalf of folks like Shi Tao, sentenced to 10 years imprisonment for using his Yahoo mail account in a way that the Chinese government didn’t like.
Finally, we must be peaceful and creative in our interactions on Wednesday. No one gains when there is disrespect, violence or a lack of dialogue. We must sent this third message loud and clear: “Although I disagree with you, I will listen to you.” We need to commit to listening very carefully to folks with whom we disagree. This includes respected scholars and lawyers, religious leaders, but it also includes everyday people whom we will meet at the demonstration. We must listen because we understand that no one has a monopoly on the truth. In San Francisco, if no where else, and Wednesday, if no other day, we must affirm that politics, human rights and dignity involve complicated issues! To increase our understanding of these terms requires conversation. On Wednesday when I protest, my third message will be: “I am listening to you with an open mind and an open heart.”
So, a truly San Franciscan welcome would weave together:
one, respect for the torch as a symbol of the dignity of the individual — all individuals;
two, a non-violent but strenuous objection to the human rights abuses done by the Chinese government; and, three, a creative (even theatrical if it causes us to pause for even a moment!) invitation to engage in conversation.
I agree wholeheartedly with the opinion of the author. This pathetic situation is clearly evolving into an “us” vs “them” the for the white “tibetan freedom fighters”. I might note the not-so-subtle strand of racism in their tone about China, and by implication, the Chinese-Americans in this country, which I am one of. It seems to me that the underlying theme for these “do-gooders” is “if you don’t support us by denouncing your China, then you are not American”. It would tragically ironic, but not too far of a stretch, for these same people who advocate for the “freedom” for the hapless Tibetans to one day also call for the internment of those Americans of Chinese or indeed any Asian descent, or a “final solution” to these “yellow menace”. I would not be surprised, given this “holier-than-thou” attitude and tones of these so-call supporters of “human rights”. I wonder if they actually did any research on what Tibet is really like, and what the so-call evil Chinese government has been doing to bring about change there. It is always easy to fall on the comfortable cusion of “good” vs “evil”, when your mind is simplistic and dead set to demonize someone…anyone. It’s also esay to denounce someone as “brainwashed” if that person offers a different perspective. These “do-gooders” are no better than the fascist-totalitarians that they claim China to be.
Lucy,
Where have you been? what kind of white-washed news media are you paying attention to?
http://www.asianweek.com/2005/12/29/wary-of-the-new-%e2%80%98mata-hari%e2%80%99-image/
http://news.newamericamedia.org/news/view_article.html?article_id=0f25bbdd532dc20ff32bf4f536120102
Tibetans definitely deserves to be treated with the Western standards of human rights. It is within their rights to subject to the Dalai Lama’s status as God and do as he says. Dalia Lama wants all non-Tibetan to be out of the Great Tibetan region. If this is not warning of xenophobic actions, then no one gives a damn about the rights of the ordinary Han or Muslim residents who had built homes in Tibet. but of course, they are only pawns sent by the evil government to wipe out the Tibetan culture, they do not deserve our more enlightened moral values. These people have not rights.
Strange enough, I have heared many Chinese people who really experienced the “Tienanmen Square Up-rise” expressing their undersdanding about the Chinese government’s way of handling the situation. Many of these people have lived abroad for many years.
I was too small when the “up-rise” happened, but from the evidence I have gethered so far, I have to say CNN and BBC played a very bad role in it.
Here is my own opinion on China today, based on my own experience:
1. There are millions of problems in China
2. Human right is not yet well protected
but, most importantly,
3. The current government is trying its best to make China a better country.
I don’t know what is a good government in western people’s eyes. But I think the Chinese one is not so bad!
John Savard: “The Tibetan people suffered during the Cultural Revolution, and this wouldn’t have happened if the Beijing regime hadn’t intruded upon them. That’s all we need to know, no “complicated economic, cultural and political forces” can excuse that”
Similarly, I can say, the native American people suffered for 200 years, and this wouldn’t have happened if the white men hadn’t intruded upon them. That’s all we need to know, no “complicated economic, cultural and political forces” can excuse that.
Tibet supporters, let’s cut to the chase and do something real.
The U.S. and all democratic countries should firmly stand up for Tibetans and show the world that we are the leader of freedom and democracy. At a minimum we should re-open the CIA military training camp for Tibet freedom fighters at Camp Hale near Leadville, Colorado. They already worked with CIA in 1950’s-1970’s. Now it is time for us to refresh our obligation to the human rights of those oppressed Tibetans.
Sure, the economy is not going perfect and may pose some financial problems for the operation. But it is our moral obligation that freedom is noble and worth fighting for, that freedom is not to be traded with cheap toys and apparel made by Chinese sweat labor. We can rally help among our rich democratic allies for the Free Tibet cause. We can ask Japanese, as they should remember that Dalai Lama enthusiastically endorsed a Japanese spiritual movement,’Aum Shinrikyo’, in 1980’s-1990’s. We can also ask Germans, who had deep connections with Tibet in 1930’s and 1940’s. Dalai Lama’s tutor in 1940’s was Heinrich Harrer, a member of the ‘Schutzstaffel’. Together we can form a coalition force making Tibet our dreamed Shangri-La.
Let’s do it!
Through all the years of abuse from outside, Japanese occupation, opium war and internal conflict, China of today is like a turtle. Its hard on the outside and soft on the inside. On the economics side, it’s like a turtle in the sea, it can swim quickly. On the political freedom side, it’s like a turtle on sand. You can poke at it all you want, it is not going to move any faster. Just be careful that you may not poke it so hard that it will just go back in the shell. China has made lots of progress on all fronts in the past few decade. We need to be patient. If China collapse, you may see Iraq like conditions on the whole planet.
In terms of development, China is about 40 years behind the US. Where was the US 40 years ago? Remember Martin Luther King?
In terms of human rights violation, the US just has more experience covering things up. China is like an amateur, very sloppy. The US would have just assinated the Dalai Lama like Dr. King. Anybody who serious challange the US government would be accidentally killed, not tortured and live to tell. China will learn one day.
I got a ticket the other day for safety violation, because one of my brake lights was out. After inspecting it, nothing was wrong with it. I try to fight the ticket, but was told that I could be fined up to $500 if I fail to prove it. I end up paying the $76. This is an example of a rights violation being covered. Yes I have the right to fight, but not really if you consider the consequences.
Our whole government is just as corrupted, they just do a better job covering up.
Yes, let do something. Lets fight for freedom and justice. Afganistan is almost freed, Iraq is almost freed, let’s Free Tibet next. Yes, there are thousands of freedom lovers waiting to be freed. Let’s keep fighting, who cares about the economy. Let’s keep fighting, who cares about the budget deficit. Let’s keep fighting, who cares about the price of oil. Let’s keep fighting, who cares if more US soldiers die. Let’s keep fighting, who cares if more bloodshed to innocent civilians. Let’s keep fighting, who cares if we all die. Let’s keep fighting, who cares if the whole planet blows up. What’s more important is our high moral and dignity.
China’s human rights abuses are “staggering”: the detention of hundreds of thousands of people, including political activists, for “reeducation” programs, and forced labor camps; and the liberal use of the death penalty in China — including for political prisoners — which makes China the site of 8 of every 10 government administered executions carried out in the world!
It is clear that the Communists can’t be trusted at all and they have a bag full of tricks to fool not only Tibetans but the people of China with a state-controlled press. The solution is a free Tibet. There is no doubt that a sovereign Tibet would be a savior state not only for Tibetans but for all ethnic groups of China who have nowhere to go if they disagree with the CPC. A free Tibet would be such a free democratic heaven and haven.
Most of the above and foregoing comments are more than interesting and instructive, both about the issues addressed and the addressers.
Loved mthood, but have a question for “mike”:
You have not noticed the literal groundswell of Sinophobia in the mainstream media of late? From tainted pet foods to poisoned toys to the current and massive anti-China campaign of the “Free Tibet” p.r. guys?
And has anyone noted the authentic irony in this exploiting of the “Olympic Games” that the “originals” were considered sacrosanct — above politics AND war — by those who originated this concept of “excellence”?
Not that this concept hasn’t, of late, grown more and more meretricious, like “the ‘Oscars’?”, and less and less open and available to the hoi-polloi? In ticket price, that is. Where is Socrates when we need him? Forget Diogenes.
Frank Eng
P.S.: Hope “Dave” is right, and sophisticated San Franciscans will NOT resort to any destruction and violence when that “sacred” flame passes by. Just bnng those Falun gongs.
Frank Eng, the circumlocuting champion of the oppressed, except when his own kind is doing the oppressing.
I lived in Lhasa for the past 18 months and experienced the uprising/riot/protest, etc. Your choice of terms probably expresses your pro-Tibet/China beliefs. What is reality, or truth of this situation? Most believe what they already believe, and reject what they do not. Who do you trust? Chinese or Western media?
Each version of reality is different, and focuses on saving “face,” and perpetuating their reality. So how do you decide what is truth?
In Tibet, it is difficult to determine what really happened; What started the violence? The monks or the police? How many died? How many Chinese or Tibetans? The primary sources of information (TV/press/internet) are filtered by the government. Outside media is often filtered, so news travels by rumors, gossip, insiders, etc., but by reading and talking, you can receive different views of an issue or event. If you can rise above the good vs. bad, right vs. wrong judgments, perhaps you can be neutral; seeing both sides, finding the “middle path” that can sometimes lead to peace, instead of violence. This path requires time, patience, negotiation, compromises and transparency to involve people and develop trust. Critical is the intention to avoid violence and find peace. This, I believe, is the best position for all bystanders and observers of the conflicts among the China-Tibet-Nepal-Thailand-Pakistan-India-
Russia-Myanmar-Iraq-Iran-Israel-Darfur conflicts. Violence leads to more violence and more animosity among people as we choose sides. The peaceful ways of showing support for human rights and justice are not common practice; it is not taught in schools, or presented in sermons, nor promoted by media, altough it’s a universal spiritual belief.
We only see/read/hear about problems without solutions, stirring up hatred and triggering violent responses towards our enemies who are also defined by media . It’s the evil Chinese, Tibetans, Muslims or Jews. Take your pick. We show our patriotism by hating foreigners, infidels, liberals/conservatives, etc., who then become our enemies. Just read these posts and see how it goes on and on. We need to change ourselves.
Tibet – the “Inconvenient Truth”
1. Tibetan Buddhist hierarchy – a combination of religion institution and secular governing body:
Contrary to the popular belief (molded and ingrained mostly by the western mainstream medias and probably in the textbooks as well) in the West, Tibetan Buddhist society was, never a pure form of religious institution in Chinese history, instead, a fundamentalism for as well as an extension of the then secular government solely consisted of slavery landlords. Tibetan Buddhism monasteries both directly and indirectly preserved the feudal system ruling the region for centuries with extreme cruelty, such as peeling off slaves’ skins to make drums, beheading prisoners to use their skull to make bowls. Dismantlement of limbs and gouging out of eyes were common punitive punishment was a memory as recent as 1940s of last century until the communist uprooted ruling class of the then Tibetan region.
The western so-called communist “invasion” and later on its crackdown of rebellion in the ensuing year was in fact not prompted by the quest for territorial gain (anyone with rich knowledge of Chinese history would know the legitimacy behind China’s claim of the region as a integrated part of the country), but rather the result of inevitable clash between two vastly different social ideologies.
As a result most of the Tibet exiles following Dalai Lama, old or new, are those who used to be the beneficiaries of that Tibetan feudal system. They are not real Tibetan people.
2. Dalai Lama – never a spiritual leader in Chinese Buddhism followers’ mind:
To understand this, western minds must abandon the perceived comparison between Buddhism and Christianity, particularly Catholic Church. Chinese Buddhism, due to its pacifist philosophy of life, has never developed into a unified and highly organized religious system. There is NEITHER a Buddhist “Bible” NOR a Buddhist “Vatican” to speak of is self evidence.
In Buddhism the reverence towards a certain living individual is of only academic value – no more, no less. In Chinese traditional point of view, living in seclusion was and still is regarded of the highest Way of Buddhist living. Participation in politicking is scorned off by mainstream Chinese Buddhism. From this standing point, it is not difficult to see why Dalai Lama does not have the respect from Chinese people, let alone win hearts and souls.
The Nobel Prize to Dalai Lama was just a poorly orchestrated politic joke in an ordinary Chinese eye. So please, if you happen to see Mr. Lama coming your way in the street, don’t be scared. A polite “Hi, there!” will be sufficient enough to fulfill your social courtesy.
3. Any logic behind the western medias’ truth-less report and inflammable commentaries:
Firstly, if there was no western reporter inside Tibet during the course of the riot, how can the various news agencies could justifiably declare they had told the public a true story? Second, manipulations of photographs, distortion of facts are surely not deemed as professionally ethical or even legal under the law of “freedom of speech”? Thirdly, when facts desperately in short supply, on what basis did editors and commentators alike make all those comments and accusations?
If we to take a leaf out of the book of the western justice system – “innocent until proven guilty” – to depict the bias of the western medias in this Tibet issue, we have to reverse the sentence and plus, and then it shall read like this: “guilty until proven innocent – but we are the judge and the jury”.
But there is the famous English saying even more deafening:
“You can fool all the people some of the time and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time”. I hope you take it to your mind – because it is YOUR reputation on the line; and what’s more, as a news agency, reputation is your flesh and blood. Without them you are bound to be out of business – sooner or later.
4. Reaction from some of the world leaders:
It is absolutely shocking to see how they have acted the way like, with due respect to the artists, a pop star – caring only the quality of the tenor and the velocity of the voice, but not giving a dime about what exactly what they were talking about.
Isn’t it the leader of a nation should be the most knowledgeable (with the help of his/her think tank) person among his/her peers? Maturity should be the virtue of his/her leadership, right? And most importantly the national interest should certainly be the order of his/her job?
But hell no! As the anti-China shenanigan uncoiling we see you guys became headless, putting up some ugly no-brainer shows that certainly will not benefit the countries that you are elected to serve. Trust me on this one: whenever there is an action, there will be a reaction. If you want a friend you must yourself act like one; if you want an enemy you just carry on what you are doing now. China is not your wholesale market – she has survived over 6000 years, and mind you, for most part she had no idea where on earth the West was.
By the way, USA, the self-proclaimed leader of the free world, is just over 200 years old. If culture is the soul food and history the time for a nation to grow strong and healthy, it certainly lacks in both. The establishment of a strong and beautiful nation is just like the making of a noble spirit. From this point of view I tend to agree with the Scots: the American Whiskey (or any other Whiskey for that matter) is not Whisky.
As for the topic of morality and human rights, I dare say each and every Chinese baby has been born over 6000 years old. Please save your breath, or better still – lecture to yourselves if you want to. We know what we want and no force in the world could ever change that.
5. An advice to those who threaten to boycott Beijing Olympics:
I challenge you do what you say and say what you mean, please.
To your knowledge, the most cultivated value in Chinese tradition is to be humble and modest. We learned it since childhood.
What does this to do with “boycotting Beijing Olympics”? It surely does.
Because your boycott threats have just betrayed your feel of arrogance hidden in your innermost heart though it is entirely unjustifiable, which is just the adversary to the above-said value so cherished by Chinese people. Tell you the truth: you do know how to flatter yourselves indeed.
I advise you don’t ever backtrack your “boycott” threat, seriously. Because if you do, you will find you are NOT welcomed in China no matter where you go. And you’d better keep your words. Thus, at least we will respect you to be a person of your own conviction – be it wise or stupid.
6. Shame on China?
I don’t think so. To quell a riot and to protect innocent people and to ensure law and order are nothing to be ashamed of. Those violent mob led by Tibetan monks are the shameful lot. And so are those who use physical violence in protest against the Olympic Torch Rally. They have just shown the world how ugly and brutal and lawless they are. There is none too blind for those who don’t wish to see. As to those who insist to twist the facts they are simply from verbal diarrhea.
7. If you care to know who I am:
I am proud to tell you this: I am no government employee if this is what you want to know. But I am well educated and probably know the world a little better than those who are making big noises on their over-sized stages.
I am just an ordinary Chinese!
Folks:
One more “caution” here.
While we’uns are brawling and growling at one another over what is, in essence, a passing and relatively “minor” (yes, I know, not to Tibetans) incident, and a staged one at that, something much more germane, relevant, AND immense to America and Americans, dunno about the Brits, and even Sarkozy’s French today, is the matter of “iran.”
Whereas the reported Russian report of an Iran strike this past weekend did NOT occur, please read today’s Info Clearing House piece by Paul Craig Roberts about NEXT week’s Petraeus “report” and the likelihood of an Iran strike following.
Point here is that Roberts insists, and I, for one believe, based on the record, yes, you, Nancy!, that a complicit Congress will go along.
McCain is already on the front lines, but how say you? Mme. Senator. And, more to the point, you as well, Sen. Obama?
I think it is much much more important to man the anti-Iran-strike barricades than either jeer OR cheer the passing Olympic Torch come Tuesday.
Frank Eng
P.S.: Rick, are you talking about Mao’s “great leap backward”? That’s more than a generation ago, two? And, like the young lady asking for documentation of FBI snoopings, I ask for the same here. No, western media reports are not enougb.
P.P.S.: Those commie-haters too, seem to me, to be at least two generations behind the times as well. Poor Karl. And he was only trying to help “the masses,” huddled or no. And, no, I never carried a “card,” much less wanted one, insofar as the “Party” was far too “dialectical”?
The opposite of Sinophobia is Chinese Xenophobia, the irrational fear of external influence. When the world chides the Chinese regime for ill-treating minorities and human rights abuses, the local propaganda machine never fails to use the “it’s our internal affair” excuse. When u see your neighbor beating up his wife, i think u have a right to intervene.
Unlike the Jewish folks, who have deep angst since birth that the rest of the world is out to get them (true in some instances), the Chinese around the globe are simply too soft, too complacent, and too trusting. It truly amazes me while so many Chinese can do so well competing against others in so many fields, yet so few take up the keyboard around the world to fight against defamation of their own kind. Sinophobia and racial prejudice against the Chinese have always been high historically, and have been whipped to a fevered froth in the last few months, with exaggerated claims for adulterated foods and allegedly poisoned toys (even though amazingly no one was even significantly harmed, let alone died), and all manner of unsupportable “China Threat” theories.
It is time and it is the duty of every Chinese around the globe to fight prejudice and lies against China and the Chinese.
The Committee of 100, which works quite a bit with the Jewish ADL, can take the lead and encourage all Chinese in America and then the world, to write and speak and protest against lies directed at China and the Chinese. This is one area in which the Chinese can learn quite a bit from the Jewish folks.
Frankly, I’m glad this has happened, not for the DaLie Lama and his followers, but for the Chinese people. It’s just wonderful how they have been galvanized to defend China. Their netizens have certainly put the western media on the defensive. By being more aggressive they’ve done a far better job than their own government in revealing the hypocrisy of the western media. Bottom line is the education of the average Chinese person in this area. It’s about time…!!!!
Probably for the very first time, people in the west are beginning to realise that the Chinese people are not waiting to be ’saved’ by westerners, that they are not about to ‘overthrow’ their government, that they do indeed support their government. In dealing with China the western media is finally coming to realise that it’s not just the government of China it is dealing with, but with its people.
There is a delicious and hilarious irony to all of this. The western media has been quick to defend these ‘netizens’ when their (Chinese) government censors the net. Now these same ‘netizens’ are slamming the western media. I wonder if CNN are now secretly hoping the Chinese government censors the website anticnn. com…
To Stephen Kastner; bang on! You’re right!
To mthood: hilarious!!!!
Tibet was and is a part of China,Dalai Lama wanna uses Olympic to separate China,i don’t think he’ll succeed.
Many people always say China invaded Xizang,please read history of China first,on the contraray,they never mentioned how western power invaded Xizang,Beijing. Beijing was destoried by 8 country allies.
I deeply know Xizang’s past and current.Xizang was invaded by Uk,as UK used Xizang to safeguard its colony India,so UK tried its best to split China at that time,as KMT had good relationship with USA,so UK’s aim failed,US did not want see Xizang off from R.O.China.After PRC birthed,USA wanted Xizang independant,but it failed to fight with PLA in N.Korea,then USA gradually gave up its attempt,China made diplomatic relationship with USA in 1970s.Dalai Lama self knows it’s harder for him to be a “PRESIDENT OF Xizang’.Dalai Lama once profoundly said he is merely a CARD for western powers to negotiate with China.
Olympics comes,Dalai Lama thinks it’s the best chance to arrive for independance,but he does not know how much positive change has taken place in Xizang.Poeple ’s living level is strinkingly improved in Xizang,Qinghai-Xizang Railway operated.China invested more in Xizang,other ethnic Chinese help Xizang by a big hand. Xizang is stepping on a promosing way,more Xizangnese work and study in inland of China.
Dalai Lama is relatively lucky,as they can convince those pro-Xizang independance guys to smear China on torch relay journey.
China is highly focused by the world,everything has two sides,Dalai Lama’s movement is bigger,China will become stronger on guarding its integal sovereigty,his final failure will prove what really minority ethnics need in China:prosperity,harmony,and better life.China ’s foremost task is integality,development.
Some anti-China activists will be shocked by China Miracle,their intention to separate and smear China will be futile.
Western media, politicans and so called rightist are all bias and practising double standard. Remember when American resumed control of Hawaii, the whole native population signed a petition for independance. The American refused to talk to them. What a shame!
The disgusting and obnoxious behavior of those Tibetan “do-gooders” trying to “take out ” the torch is just one example of what happens when rationale thinking and critical analysis are shoved aside for empty slogan and bandwagon herd mentality. Most white supporters of Tibet could not even point to Lhasa on a world map, let alone truly careing for the “welfare of Tibetans”.
Some predictions….
Tibet will always be a part of China, present and future. It will grow, prosper and share the same fate as the rest of China.
The Dalai Lama is in his 70’s, and we will never know who he will “re-incarnate” into. I personally dont care, and he will pass his last days never ever seeing his homeland again. The Tibetan Youth Congress will resort to terrorist tactics, and they will be labelled as such, and hunted down by China’s Ministry of State Security. All gloves will now come off.
The Beijing Olympics wll go on…and all Chinese will be proud. Sarkozy and that German woman who choose to boycott. …Good luck to them and their German/French companies. No more Airbus orders for a while, and VW and Audis will suddenly be out of favor. These politicians will get a lot of criticism from their big corporate supporters. Their days will not be comfortable.
The Beijing leadership will wise up. Why did they make this “Game” into such a public show of “Face” anyway? I am surprised that these “master tacticians” of China’s great imperial legacies could be so DUMB as to not realize that, the more you put your “face” on the line, the more others will want to pee on it and bash it? Why invite all the heads of states so that they can hold you hostage by threatening to not come? Why ask for a global trek of the flame, when previously, it was only done in the host nation? Are you deliberately asking to be humiliated? Why wasn’t the Paris leg of the trek not cancelled, both to humiliate Sarkozy and to make sure the safety of the flame. Beijing has a lot to learn about the real western world. It is so naive and stupid, and so slow and lumbering to respond with any creativity and decisiove force. While I support China’s Olympics, I am disappointed by the wavering, indecisive and clumsy/naive and frankly idiotic ations/non-actions of the Chinese government/ diplomatic corp. Some heads need to roll in Beijing…Smarten up, China. You are too naive!!!!!!!
There is an old Native American saying, “A man’s worth is not to be judged by his possessions, but by the number and strengths of his enemies.”
But for a nation, it is perhaps judged by its possessions, its enemies, and how much it is needed.
This is simple geopolitical reality that modern political activists have forgotten. That “respect” is probably the least of any government’s concern.
(1) Possession: China possesses Tibet, by treaty rights and by physical presence. It’s fact, it is reality that has existed almost 60 years. No sane government will give up that much territory for “respect” or for a “game”.
(2) Enemies: China is not stupid. It has no illusions that its political enemies on various issues will rest. Even after the Olympics, the activists will still protest give any opportunity. Even if China granted everything they asked for, they will still be more protests. In reality, every government faces criticisms and protests abroad. US Presidents take it in stride. Chinese press suppression of such news is propaganda, but so are the protests, which based hardly on reality.
(3) Needs: Bottomline, the World, hard as it allows admission, NEEDS China. That is a hard reality that will NOT go away. Trade is perhaps the most basic need. But there is more. China sits on the Security Council with veto power. But even more, as 1st world nations fade in influence around the world, China is increasinly called to help with troubled areas like Iran, North Korea, and yes, even Sudan/Darfur. Western nations have lost their influence over time via hardline tactics like sanctions and wars. Reality is, “starve and bomb” diplomacy simply does not work. Yet, the Protesters think China is not “doing enough”. Well, if China also did the “starve and bomb” diplomacy, it won’t get anywhere either.
The Western notion of influence, aka “Starve and Bomb” campaigns, teaches us something about the Protests against China. That in reality, such tactics won’t work.
Les we forget history, China (PRC) has gone through economic embargo, and political sanctions. What can protests do to China that its people have not seen before?
And the vain hope that somehow the Chinese People will awaken to reject the Communist Government is hardly logical.
If Tibetan Exiles are so easily willing to forget their own brutal Theocratic history for the sake of their own “sovereignty” and Independence, what makes them think that they can make the Chinese people feel strongly about “human rights” and sacrifice their own “sovereignty”??
James, if the west has no culture, why are all the 6000 year old Chinese babies mimicking the great musical expressions of the west?
I think it’s clear from all of the anti-American sentiment here where the majority of the comments lie. However, the country I love and the one I live in is America. Bashing America is not only wrong, but a smokescreen - a diversion from China’s real human rights record. Is it possible to be Asian and be a loyal American? I know it is, but reading the sentiment behing this editorial the comments that follows leads to doubt.
So much hatred from Chinese citizens living in China and abroad, no wonder no country in the world (except Burma, Sudan and North Korea) trust you!!!
When China and Chinese people treat Tibetans so bad, the world should be cautious about Chinas “peaceful rise” ..
Mark,
If Asian Americans talking about US problems is “bashing America”, then is talking about China’s problems “bashing China”?
And questioning Asian American “loyalty” is hardly the sign of an enlightened democracy.
Greg,
Does any country really “trust” any other country? Trust US?
“Human Rights” is just another pretext for Wars.
I think many countries would choose a “peaceful rise” over “War of Human rights”.
I don’t think Chinese Americans are afraid to speak out…it’s more like they agree with China’s handling of Tibet. Most Chinese Americans I’ve come across best line of defense is…”mind your own business” in regards to China vs. Tibet….which they follow up with cold and calculated historical facts about why China owns Tibet.
I just call it bull$hit.
As an Asian American myself, I find it troubling that an Asian American writer thinks in order to be a true Asian American….you shouldn’t speak out against China’s treatment of Tibet because of the “white man persuasion.” In fact, the reason why Asian Americans are silent is because they all side with China…..well, maybe the Chinese American community, but not those who have a mind of their own.
Most Asian Americans can think for themselves and can figure out why China’s handling of Tibet is wrong…and for me, it smells a whole lot like Japan’s imperialization of China.
and boycott the olympics….that’s right, I said it James. Freedom of speech baby. ;)
“It’s not so surprising that the Chinese American community has remained largely silent in the face of all the sound and fury. The nearly all white Board of Supervisors simply doesn’t represent Chinese Americans or Asian Americans in San Francisco. It’s as if the community is saying, “No need to waste our voices on deaf ears.”” Yeah, go ahead, play the race card - it’s really all you’ve got. China has achieved a level of barbarism unparalleled in human history. I applaud the protests that have accompanied the Olympic torch at every step of its journey (apart from Beijing, of course - protestors are shot on site in the PRC). The demonstrators are exposing China’s genocidal machinations both within Tibet and its own borders. The entire world (with the exceptions of such bastions of freedom as North Korea, Sudan and Nepal) condemns the PRC.
Such BS China bashing. I hope the Chinese American community is ready for a full force display of support for the Olympic flame when it gets here. Let’s show them that we are proud to be American AND Chinese. Let’s everyone Unite. For the first time, we can show the world that we are as attached to our ethnic motherland as the Irish, the Italians and the Polish Americans are. It is our right to do so!!!! If some people cant deal with it, there’s the bridge….we have the law and the right on our side!
“imperialization…”…
This is not a word.
“it smells a whole lot like Japan’s imperialization of China. “…
Do you want the CHN government to do a “Lhasa Massacre” of 300,000?
“boycott the olympics….that’s right, I said it “…
“May the Dalai Lama die a lonely death without ever seeing his homeland ever again”…there, I said it.
“maybe the Chinese American community, but not those who have a mind of their own. “…
Typical arrogance from someone who can’t deal with divergent pinions. How strange that these are also the VERY same ones who want “freedom” for Tibetans!!!!!! A very typical arrogance from the screaming liberal left. Fascist Liberalism at its best, you get that award!
It’s funny how the Chinese trust a Communist media, which has been brainwashing them since 1950+ and call Western Free media a lie.
It’s also funny how they hold American passport but still shows allegiance to the coummist Government in China.
It’s funny why they enjoy free speech in USA, at the same time support oppression of free speech in China.
It’s funny when they choose to hire/marry/live with people from Asian community while blaming others for avoiding them (I was told by one wise guy that they don’t support out-of-chinese marriage because of the blood purity!)
My question to you, all Asians, do you love USA or China? If you love USA, why don’t you support our freedom?
Mike,
Chinese Americans are not afraid to speak.
But “speaking” is often just empty or “double talk”, or “speaking” just leads to rumors and mob violence.
(1) if the world really cared, they would boycott all Chinese goods, and indeed, boycott all companies that do business with China. Boycotting “olympics” does nothing.
But most people don’t, they just “speak”. Nancy Pelosi herself, TALK, but does not support “boycott”.
(2) History of China during the Cultural Revolution, indicates how “speaking” by a mob of Red Guards do nothing more than incite rumors, paranoia, and violence, no less severe than the angry anti-Communist mob in US during the McCarthy era, and the anti-Japanese mobs WWII, and the anti-Chinese mobs during the era of Chinese Exclusion Act in US.
(3) Cold calculated historical facts are just that, FACTS.
China’s claims on Tibet have been recognized since well before 1949, by treaties.
It’s hardly comparable to Japan, which was condemned by the League of Nations.
Only the sick in the head would find it “funny” that the Chinese trust a Communist media . . . and call Western Free media a lie.”
Either they lied or they did not lie. This time the Western “free media” lied and distorted the reporting. It is right and righteous for any and all Chinese to call them to it.
As to your sick, McCarthyite ranting of “My question to you, all Asians, do you love USA or China? If you love USA, why don’t you support our freedom?” - the Chinese Americans have freedoms in America just as you do, and it is the melding of ALL of those freedoms that constitute true American freedom. By questioning and trampling on the freedom of any group to choose, you are destroying American freedom.
Jewish folks are allowed to love both America and Israel. Italian Americans can sing praises of the Old Country. Irish Americans can wear green and parade their culture from Ireland all year long. The Chinese Americans are yet not allowed the love of the nation and culture of their ancestors? Chinese Americans are second class citizens in America? Whether or not that is true, ALL Chinese Americans must reject that and fight against even any suggestion of this insult.
This recent onslaught of cheap shot attacks on China by the pols and by the press constitute direct insult against each and every American Chinese.
WHY should the community take it sitting down? If the pol attacks the Chinese, the Chinese should make the displeasure known, and support someone who honors the community. If the press distorts the truth, the Chinese should speak out and correct such misinformation.
Only then will freedom wrought.
“The US would have just assinated the Dalai Lama like Dr. King. Anybody who serious challange the US government would be accidentally killed, not tortured and live to tell. China will learn one day.”
China should really learn to be as sly as the U.S.: when the Chinese embassy was bombed by the U.S., it was a “mistake” in the “outdated” map; when the nuclear fuse was sent to Taiwan by the U.S., it was a “shipping error”.
I am also curious why China didn’t cancel the Paris leg. That big mouth insignicant french(s) is a joke anyway.
Wow, reading all the comments from Chinese-Americans here is a real eye-opener. I had no idea so many shared in a pathetic, bigoted China First/evil whitey is out to get us/evil America should never criticize our precious blameless PRC paranoid mindset. After reading what’s been posted here, I’m not only hoping the torch run in SF s trashed and made a mockery of, but I will personally boycott all made-in-PRC products and encourage others to do so. Keep up the good work, folks: you’re opening some dumb round-eyes to the reality of what you fascists actually think.
My question to you, all Asians, do you love USA or China? If you love USA, why don’t you support our freedom?
–Robert Mui on Apr 07, 2008
Robert,
Its funny that we Americans have blood on our hands from abu ghraib, yet we attack China for abuse.
Its funny that we Americans spent more money on defense then the whole world combine, yet we attack China for their weak military spending.
Its funny that we Americans kill thousands of innocent Iraqi, yet we attack China for suppressing unrest.
Its funny that we Americans support former dictator Saddam Hussein for oil, yet we attack China for supporting Dafur, Sudan for oil.
Yes we love the USA, and we are supporting our freedom by speaking freely about what is wrong with our government and our double standards. By doing so we hope to keep the USA lovable not just by Asian American but by the whole world.
Those idiotic protesters in London, Paris, San Francisco are all radical losers. Very naive, misguided, and misled by well-financed political groups with vicious agenda. I was impressed by Yoichi Shimatsu’s article, seldom a Japanese has this much insight into understanding the complicated web of relationships in a multi-cultural society. I respect the Dalai Lama for his wealth of knowledge and especially for his championing of non-violent struggle for his people. However, we must also keep in mind that he is a religious political leader, his hidden agenda is to rule the Tibetan people under a theocracy. I somewhat agree with Dalai Lama’s claim of China cultural genocide of Tibet. I think the Chinese government doesn’t really know how to manage a multi-ethnic society. Forced “education” classes and brainwashing only have the opposite effect: seeding further resentment of the government. I think Mao’s original goal of conquering Tibet is to spread communist ideology rather than empire-building, but he was naive in a way that he didn’t really understand the role of religion in a society; you cannot just convert a population steeped in religious tradition and change it overnight.
Let’s keep things straight: Not all Asians are Chinese; Not all Chinese are from mainland China; not all mainland Chinese support Chinese government’s policy.
First, “Asian people” refer to a very large and diverse group, of which Chinese is just a component. Don’t blame “Asians” for what the Chinese are doing, and don’t use the banner “Asians” or “Asian Americans” to drum up Chinese interests. Second, not all people of Chinese ancestry are from mainland China or support Beijing’s policy. For example, many people in Taiwan can be considered Chinese based on their ancestry, but some detest what mainland China is doing. Third, not all mainland Chinese people agree with Chinese government’s policies. Some even protest against them, at much personal risk.
Chinese Communist Party took over the mainland in 1949 and has tightly controlled textbooks and news media ever since. Unless a mainland Chinese person was born well before that and has had a chance to form independent thoughts, that person has been subjected to official party-line propaganda heavily, if not the entire lifetime. Some got to Western countries and might learn a thing or two (like arguing in English on the Internet), and some might even start to disbelieve Chinese communist government’s propaganda. But Chinese resentment towards Western powers still runs deep, very deep, and so does Chinese nationalistic pride, to the point that most Chinese always take a China-first stance regardless of their current citizenship.
How do I know? Being a Chinese-Taiwanese, I’m kind of one of them.
When criticizing the suppression in Tibet, specifically call out “Chinese government”, don’t just say “the Chinese” as that includes millions of powerless poor people. When refer to people of Chinese ancestry, use “Chinese”, not “Asian”.
Who is the idiot who wrote this op piece???
Wowsers, you just realized all this now? There is a sub-set of Asians that are HIGHLY insecure, and the blame game is almost out of control. You summed up things very well though.
agg It is amazing that Chinese can be so brainwashed by the PRC, even those who are not under the PRC. Oh, we are victims, West pushes us down, Japan pushes us down, Martians push us down. Respect Chinese! Don’t let foreigners look down on us. Did you idiots ever think that people look down on you for this ridiculous behavior? No, don’t look inward, put your head in the ground and blame others. I mean, your culture is so divine, no one else could possibly understand. What a load of rubbish. If you are a real proud “Chinese”, you are a human being first. At least have the balls to criticize your own culture - for FRAKIN once.
“Chinese resentment towards Western powers still runs deep, very deep”. Then it is up to the Chinese, and only the Chinese, to give it a rest already. It is obvious the politicians in China keep this fire alive, but if individuals can’t look beyond the past, then they are just as bad. Humans have done plenty of lousy things to their fellow humans in the past. I see articles from PRC saying, “don’t let foreigners look down on Chinese”. Don’t tell me you can’t look at what is going on here from a humanistic point of view. If you can’t, well, the World is f’ed in the long run.
Woaa there James from China, you have some MAJOR brainwashed arrogance going on there. You say the US is only 200 years? Well the combined immigrant culture in the US are 100,000 years old. We have Chinese, we have Greeks, we have Italy/Romans, Egyptians. Your culture is so great, eh? Anyone that has to say it so explicitly like you is one thing — a little insecure shrub.
agg Yeah, whites are out to get us. It is all a conspiracy. West insult Chinese, we will never forget. Those eight armies push us down, we will fight forever. Fight, fight, fight, great 6,000 year old China will get what she wants. After we get rid of west/euro/white, then we take over the World. YA!
The spirit embodied in the Olympic torch is one of peace, friendship, and progress.
The majority of Americans and world citizens (99%) support the 2008 Summer Olympics in Beijing. However, the radical fundamentalists (1%) that are driven by a narrow ideology of extremism are using violent tactics in order to force their unwanted ideology on others. These protestors have shown that they represent the opposite of what the Olympics are about.
The spirit of the Olympics will survive in the torch. The Olympic torch represents the will of the majority of the citizens of the world. In the final journey of the torch to Beijing, the world will rejoice the rekindling of the human spirit.
We may have differences. However, we all will work together to make the Olympics a positive sporting event for humanity.
But, let’s not spoil the Olympics for all of our athletes and families who have trained so hard to compete in this sporting event.
I agree with Nancy Rose’s comment.
Let’s all stop the politicization of the Olympics sporting event. I’m tired of all the personal attacks that I see on this blog.
Stop your political demogogery and your stupid ideological nonsense. Furthermore, stop behaving like immature children that personally attack each other and start behaving like mature adults!
I’m a SPORTS FAN and I want to watch my team compete in Beijing in 2008.
If you don’t want to watch the Olympics, then turn off your TV set. Sheesh.
Have you ever seen a Jew criticize Israel in front of goyim? Of course there would be a few, the exceptional, much like the JYGZ (jia yang gui zhi) in present company. Does it mean that the Jewish folks do not criticize Israel? Hardly- it is just not “profitable” to do so in front of goyim, just as it is not profitable for the ethnic Chinese, be they Chinese American, Chinese Brit, Chinese Australian or whatever, to criticize China in front of the gweilo. An ethnic group that feels no pride and is not protective of its own culture, has no future. That’s why the Irish still wear green and paint the whole town green on St. Patrick’s day.
You mean to tell us that the Chinese in America do not have the freedom to choose to support the nation of their ancestors? Given the warped “reporting” by major media in the last few months, it is hardly paranoia to stay alert, and to pool resources to fight the lies.
This is not against the Chinese people or even against China. It again the click in power in the Chinese governemement who victimize not only the people of Tibet but the people of China too.
Remember Tianamen square?
Why is’nt any Han Chinese resenting the Manchus for invading China and starting the Qing dynasty? Oh yeah, Manchuria is now a province, and many Han Chinese are actually descended from Manchus.
I studied and worked in China for more than 20 years. If you are a foreigner from 3rd world counrty in China, you’d know how the human rights work.
1. All foreigners are supposed to report to Police every 6 to 12 months, Police decides where foreigners can stay (yes, only nominated hotels can take foreigners!)
2. No foreigner, no matter how long they stay in China, can ever get the permission to stay indefinitely (unlike USA or Canada)
3. All foreigners are kept out of Government jobs
4. We were also barred from attending “Chinese-only” classes, Black people are especially singled out in any social activity (yes, Racism is there!)
5. If something goes wrong, it’s always the “Lao Wai”’s fault
6. China Daily is a piece of crap, never writes the truth
7. Many journalists are jailed for trying write the truth about the government (unlike USA/Canada, where journalists are free to write the truth)
8. All Chinese students must be brainwashed: by attending Communist study, attending military training and listening to Government Controlled media
So, if China didn’t do anything wrong in Tibet, why don’t they allow the foreign journalists to enter TIbet or let the people talk?
China has its own ways to manage their country. Most importantly, China should and must do what is the best for China no matter what others say or feel. The hell with the western media or opinions. And to the the hell with Dalai Lama.
The western media and society are highly hypocrital and double standard —– and shame on them.
China is on the right development course and it will not be long China will be the biggest market in the world. Then they will have a lot more influence and power. The Chinese government should keep up with the good work.
Roger Liu —
You call detaining and sending free speech supporters/democracy supporters to prison a “good work” by Chinese Government, while you are enjoying Free Speech here. Also, you may not have friends/relatives suffering from lack of justice system them…otherwise you wouldn’t say it’s a good work.
If you have courage, ask your government to let people speak!
What’s amazing is no one has brought up the deaths of both ethnic Han and Tibetans in Tibet. Before we discuss the Olympics or our political views, I think that is where the conversation should start first. Ironically, we cannot have such an informed discussion as the Chinese government has been slow to release information, taking days what normally takes minutes with independent news media. One can fault the western media but only to a degree, because it is doing what it can with limited information in a controlled, authoritarian environment. But most importantly, such organizations are independent and free. On the other hand, Xinhua’s lack of timely, objective, independent reporting compromises the credibility of its accounts. If a bias is to be discerned, it lies flatly at the conflict of interest that occurs when a government agency is the sole reporter of the news. This pattern repeats itself in Xinjiang, as unrest there, which occurred the roughly same time as in Tibet, was reported by Xinhua a week after it occurred.
An unfortunate outcome for the Chinese government is that people will come to their own conclusions regardless of what they say as recent polls show:
70% Believe IOC Was Wrong to Award Olympic Games to China
http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1474
Anyone seen this video from someone else’s perspective?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9QNKB34cJo
America really should judge itself first. You want to talk about human rights violation? How about the constant racism against Asian Americans? Constant negative stereotyping of Asians in Hollywood and in the media? How about white washing Asian American stories such as the new movie 21? How about the glass ceiling? The list goes on and on…
How about FREE AMERICA and give the land back to the real Americans the American Indian? How come we don’t have weekly protests about that?
The Dalai Lama reminds us (I am an American) of Gandhi and Martin Luther King. The behavior of the Chinese government reminds us of the KKK, and Nazis. When China abuses and represses Tibetans and Han Chinese civil rights activists, China reminds us of everything we despise. We want to be friends with China, but not at the cost of losing our ideals!
We are not condemning the Chinese people, we are condemning the Chinese government. Nothing would please us more than being able to like and respect the Chinese government, but that will not happen until it respects religious freedom and civil rights.
If you believe that critics of Chinese government policy hate China and the Chinese, how do you reconcile this with the fact that I know the names, Zhao Ziyang , Hu Yaobang, Yang Chunlin and Hu Jia, and admire and respect them? My earnest hope for freedom and civil rights for all citizens of China, including Tibetans, is a sign of my good will towards all of the citizens of China.
“I will personally boycott all made-in-PRC products and encourage others to do so. Keep up the good work, folks: you’re opening some dumb round-eyes to the reality of what you fascists actually think.”…
Good luck. You should be thankful that the hard working Chinese who work for slave labor wage provide you with cheap stuff to keep your inflation down, and your consumption up so that your waste size continue to grow to be the first in the world. You should also be glad that the Chinese buy up all the rapidly depreciating US government bonds needed to fund our little war in Iraq. If it was not for the Chinese, we would be in a huge economic mess by now. As for boycott, please do try…let’s see how far you get. talk is cheap…just do it.
As for “being Patriotic American”…
Dont worry. Lawyers are a dime a dozen. Hire them and defend our civil rights to speak freely. The Jews and all other ethnicities have learned to bash back..so they won respect. the African Americans, especially, have learned to use the guilt/law/righteousness card against the whites. We Chinese Americans need to LEARN from our African American brothers. Bash back. When they question our “loyalty”, threaten them with lawsuit!!!!!!!!!!! Sue the crap out of them, and use the law for our own benefit. That’s what being a “real” American is about.
“The Dalai Lama reminds us (I am an American) of Gandhi and Martin Luther King. ”
Sorry, but the two did not own any slaves, nor did they preside over a feudal theocracy. Get your facts straight, buddy. Can you ever reconcile a theocracy with ‘democracy”…did u ever think through what would happen to tibet if the dalai lama returned? Do you think suddenly a “democracy’ would appear like some ghostly apparition?
“The behavior of the Chinese government reminds us of the KKK, and Nazis.”…
So the KKK and the Nazis were responsible for ncreasing the life expectancy of the Blacks and the Jews from 36 to 67 years on average? Both those “nazi” Chinese must hate them tibetans so much that they sent free medical services and other social programs…FREE for the past 50 some years to keep them alive longer and to prevent them from “re-incarnating”..HOW EVIL!!!!!….Get your facts straight, foolish person.
” When China abuses and represses Tibetans and Han Chinese civil rights activists, China reminds us of everything we despise.”…
Indeed, so how do you feel when our own troops are responsible for some MAJOR crimes against the Iraqis. Does that make you gross out too…it better, or you are nothing but a self-righteous bigot.
” We want to be friends with China, but not at the cost of losing our ideals!”…
Indeed, the US is the fat consumer, and China is your enabler with cheap products. Both are at fault, and as much as you hate it, you need China to solve the global environmental problems.
“We are not condemning the Chinese people, we are condemning the Chinese government. “…
Not when the language used, the undertone, the implied messages all read….”these yellows are not worthy of our standard”. I would have more respect for your “feelings” if you actually had your facts straight (see above) before you open your trap.
“Nothing would please us more than being able to like and respect the Chinese government, but that will not happen until it respects religious freedom and civil rights. “…
And does the US government respect al aspects of religious and civil freedoms? Does it respect the inalienable right to sovereighty of other nations. You are so holier-than-thou that you should apply for being the poster Child of the “ugly american” that the world so despise. I am ashamed to call you an “american”. learn some balanced istory…not CNN soundbytes. By the way, CNN is highly unreliable, we all know now.
“If you believe that critics of Chinese government policy hate China and the Chinese, how do you reconcile this with the fact that I know the names, Zhao Ziyang , Hu Yaobang, Yang Chunlin and Hu Jia, and admire and respect them?
Did you know that Wen Jia Bao, the current premier, was a colleague/subordinate of Hu and Zhao? You dont know squat and you just proved it…
“My earnest hope for freedom and civil rights for all citizens of China,”…
It will come, at the country’s own pace. China faces particular sets of challenges, and no country in the world face the challenges that it faces (do the math). CHINA DOES NOT NEED SELF-RIGHTEOUS, IGNORANT DO-GOODERS TELLING IT WHAT TO DO.
Improve yourself before you lecture others.
“One can fault the western media but only to a degree, because it is doing what it can with limited information in a controlled, authoritarian environment. But most importantly, such organizations are independent and free.”….
yeah, free and independent to “invent’ news. Like claiming that monks are bashed in China or Xizhang when it was Katmandu? Boy, talk about using “what’s available” to make the story “fit”. Face it, even those of us who live in a free society find this disgusting…especially because it was so blatant, and so self-righteously done. You know that even the german station apologized for this “error’…right. Good job in showing the true color of the free press. Thanks.
Save your breath, Tim Dunn. We’re white/foreign devils, and thus anything we say will just wash off the backs of the brainwashed hyper-patriotic subset of Chinese who see everything associated with their ethnic homeland with extremely rose-tinted glasses. And as an Irish-American, I’ll play my own ethnic card by saying I am personally offended by a commenter’s comparison of St. Patrick’s Day with Chinese-Americans defending the policies of the PRC. Excuse me? A celebration of a Saint is now comparable to excusing sixty years of genocide and police state oppression? Wake up, people: the PRC is responsible for more deaths than either the Nazis, or the Soviets. Chinese-Americans who do not speak up in protest of the PRC regime should feel ashamed, and should face hostility and disdain from freedom-loving fellow citizens, whether Chinese, Irish, or whatever.
I hope tomorrow turns into a riot and the torch is thrown into the bay. Beijing 2008 = the Prison Games.
Wowser - how about talk about some facts vs. name calling and labeling all Chinese as some lunatics that follow China blindly? Don’t think many Chinese are highly educated in the West and actually know what’s going vs. just the usual propaganda whether it is from the West or the East?
Dalai Lama has said he DOES NOT FAVOR SEPARATION OF TIBET from China. Whether you like it or not, Tibetans are Chinese. Tibetan culture is Chinese culture and Chinese culture is Tibetan culture. Read this article: http://www.smh.com.au/news/World/Tibet-part-of-China-Dalai-Lama-agrees/2005/03/14/1110649129309.html
Do you think the separatists that want free Tibet is the majority? Did you know Tibetans in China can have as many kids as they want while Han Chinese are limited to only 1 kid? Did you know that PRC invested quite a bit into Tibet to develop the region?
Why use the Olympic as the vehicle to get the message across? Olympic is suppose to be about world unity and peace. Why use such great event to promote violent protests?
True faces of western media: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSQnK5FcKas&feature=related
There have been a ton of pro china protests throughout the world. They get almost ZERO coverage in the western media while 100 people that gathers for Free Tibet is front page news. You want talk about bias?
Chinese government is nowhere close to perfect. They got a long way to go on improving human rights. However, they are making progress however slow. Why are we Americans so quick to judge China? We got human rights violation all over the place at home. You want to live up to this country’s ideals that all MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL? How about fix racism first? How about fix all the system in this country that promotes white privilege? If you don’t know what that is and I know for a fact most white Americans don’t, please go read it up on this Website: http://whiteprivilege.com/
Put it this way, China has more claim to Tibet than whites have to America. Do you think whites would all pack up and go back to Europe and hand over the land to native Americans? Please answer this question honestly.
Rob, take a long leap off a short pier. Comparing ‘white privilege’ to the tens of millions of corpses the PRC has created since 1949 is lunacy of the highest order. The US isn’t perfect — no country is — but we’re light years ahead of the PRC when it comes to human rights. And nope, I don’t think that ‘whites would all pack up and go back to Europe and hand over the land to native Americans’, but maybe you should since you seem so intent on licking the boots of the PRC regime. Your true loyalties, Rob, have been noted. Don’t be surprised when it bites you in the ass.
I am a Chinese American. There is no need for the whole world to insult and humiliate each other. Each country has the right to do what’s needed to protect their country.
I get upset when others criticize America for trying to protect our country. Sure we had to use some unpopular tools including torture, wire tapping, war, assinations. But our country is much safer as a result and I am grateful. A few individual’s rights got violated to protect the country. I feel is absolutely necessary for survival. Remember freedom fries?
On the same token, I get equally upset when China gets bashed for trying to do what’s necessary to protect their country. At their level of development, their are lots of resentment. From their experience, peaceful protest don’t ever stay peaceful. You can get away with quite a bit of stuff in China now versus a couple decades ago. The only thing you can’t really do is make the government loose face.
I am just asking the whole world to stop criticizing and attacking a situation unless you have an answer to the problem. Looking at Iraq, I don’t think America has the answers for China either.
I don’t see China protesting the deaths of innocent Iraqis, that’s probably because they don’t have the answers either. Let’s hold hands for a better world.
Dont waste your breath, Rob. The irish guy upstairs thinks that just because he is white, and perhaps finished 9th grade public school history, he is actually qualified to say something about authoritarian dictatorships vs totalitarian cult of personalities. Indeed, I do hope that there will be a riot tomorrow, and maybe this time, the 15,000 Chinese-Americans will finally put these “white” tibetans in their place. I heard that in the paris melee, if you get the torch, you get 80 Euros, if you charge the torch, you get 5 Euros. Wow, paying thugs money to get on tv…what a great idea!
By the way, let’s not go down the road of how many injustices that the Catholic Church, as embodied by the “St Patrick” parade actually hide. Why do we celebrate a saint when he is associated with an organization that burn jews, witches and all heretics alike? What about all those innocent natives of the “New World” that died by the supposed cathorlic conquerors? I think we should bann all St Patrick’s day parades and all catholic churches, and dump all that green beer, communion wafers and the pedophile-priests in the bay!
If only people from perfect countries were allowed to protest the policies of the PRC, it would be a small crowd to be sure. As an American and a human (and an evil ‘whitey’) I have the right to say whatever I want about the PRC regime and its history of mass murder, police oppression and one-party dictatorship, full stop. Your attempt to sideline the argument into hysterically cynical and hypocritical whingeing about whites and the US (and excuse me, but one can criticize the PRC _and_ work against racism in the US at the same time — it’s not a zero-sum equation) only shows the fragility of your position and your fear that Americans and people worldwide are wising up to continued PRC oppression of not just Tibetans, but Uighars, ethnic Koreans, the Mao, and the Han themselves. But go on and keep defending the PRC and endlessly casting about trying to blame whites, Americans, Westerners and other non-Chinese for China’s own self-created problems and PR disaster. With that kind of behavior I’m sure the world will continue to cast a scornful eye on China and overseas Chinese with all due justification; you’re the equivalent of the KKK, the German-American Bund, and other fascist hypernationalists and what’s hilarious is you don’t even know it.
Why is Tibet not given the same autonomy as Hongkong?
Both are officially called “Autonomous Regions”, and Tibet was one of the first such regions.
Tibetans do not have the same freedom as Hongkongers, who can protest and exercise some democracy, and even the law enforcement in Tibet are all filled by Han Chinese without a single Tibetan.
Ethnic discrimination comes to mind. Though Hongkongers are mainly southern Chinese, they are still considered Han Chinese, whereas Tibetans are not. Still, Hongkong should worry that it may become the next Tibet once the “One Country, Two Systems” guarantee runs out in fifty years time.
To the other Rob:
Why are you so quick to judge when I am merely playing devil’s advocate and show people a different point of view? Why is it I am showing a different view that I am licking PRC’s boot?
Please answer the question on the difference between whites occupation of America vs. China’s occupation of Tibet. China at least has a history of controlling that area.
If you and many protesters’ goal is to break up China and cause civil war, then who is the one who wants to see many people getting killed? Do you think Chinese government just gonna hand over Tibet because people are protesting?
Everyone has the right to protest, but why against the Olympic? Olympic is suppose to be about peace and unity. Why don’t they go protest in front of the UN?
Chinese government is no saint. However, China has become more open from say 10 years ago. It is a slow process but it is a process. Can the process be faster? Yes but a country that size won’t change things over night . Growth of China is a threat to the west. This is why we are getting anti-China media coverage day and night.
The Tibet activists have seen that China is using the Olympics for political purpose. Why spend billions of dollars and tearing down people’s houses and building a lot of mega sports facilities? It is promoting to the world, that it is a harmonious one-China, hence the “One World, One dream” motto. The activists want to expose this deception, hence all the protests.
“Wowsers” is a “bowser.” Probably a pit bull abused by his keepers.
And the first “Rob,” or is it the second?, well, the apologist for the PRC, tells the truth to all the domestic media lies.
And “Mike” is a wonder, verse, book, and chapter on why far too many fellow Americans, you can only send me back to San Jose, kiddo, march under the macho banner of the theoneocons without even recognizing, much less saluting, their drill sergeants.
Frank Eng
P.S.: The one who hopes the Olympic Torch is spun, spiralling, into the choppy waters of the Bay surely must be the spoilsport of all time. How about a crown of thorns for him?, forget the cross. Maybe tar AND feathers?
hay…today is the torch relay…and it is also the 5th anniversary of the Invasion of Iraq…..
If you love your “freedom” and “compassion for the oppressed people of the world” so much, then I suggest you chop off one of your finger in protest against the invasion of Iraq by American armed forces. How ironic that you would go protest China after downloading a few pages off some “friend of tibet” site and shedding a few tears for Brad pitt in “Seven Years in Tibet”…but the real slaughter of tens of thousands of innocent iraqis have really happened. It’s so easy to criticize others, but when you live in a glass house, you shouldnt have a bag of stones.
Give your self-righteous whining a break. Tibet will ALWAYS be a part of China. If you are really serious, why dont you advocate the invasion and “liberation” of Tibet? I want front row seat to that bloodbath, and sadly it wont be just Chinese blood.
Pro-China Mike,
“Give your self-righteous whining a break?”
That’s like the pot belly kettle calling the cauldron black. You’re so stuck on finding hypocrisy in others that you don’t even see your own arrogance.
Stop pretending that you’re any different.
America can and will say that the Iraq invasion is illegal. We already had Ron Paul telling the rest of America they were wrong about the war during his run for presidency. We the people and our “freedom” will criticize others because criticize ourselves. We have documentary film makers using limbless war vets condemning the invasion of Iraq and we have John Stewart mocking George Bush’s intelligence. If you don’t know what I’m talking about then you really don’t know what you’re talking….because clearly, your Chinese Pride is beyond understanding what actually happens in America.
So, grow some thicker skin because not everyone is going to love China and not everyone should. I can handle people calling the USA being just as bad….because it has been and every government should always be held responsible for their actions.
Here you are condemning people for not accepting a difference of opinion and yet you yourself can’t.
“typical arrogant chinese tactic” - Mike Imitation
“So, grow some thicker skin because not everyone is going to love China and not everyone should”…
You are absolutely RIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is time that all Chinese, and Chinese-Americans grow thicker skin. We need to be the real members of the 2nd superpower. Being a superpower means people resent you, people hate you, and people are “hurt” by your actions. If you are not powerful, important, even vital in this world, then nobody would waste their time protesting YOU!!!!!! Chinese people in general need to grow out of the “VICTIM-mentality” that they have harbored since the Opium Wars. It is now time that China graduate into a “MEAT-eater”, not some poor weak veggie prey. Be proud that these idiots are protesting because of what China has done to someone else, not what someone has “done” to China. Congrats, this is what happens when you have power. All people in positions of power know this truth. So stare down your opponents, and show your strength as a power to be reckon with. Go down your own road…nobody can stop you, and no one dare hurt you. These violent protests in london, and especially paris have discredited the whole “non-violence” movement. Thinking people are sick of it.
As for protesting the war against Iraq, believe you me I do!!!!!! I would also have a lot more respect for those “white tibetans” put a bit more of their passion into speaking up for the poor Iraqis.
I am so proud to so so many Chinese people, both ethnic and nationals coming out in support of the Torch and Beijing. The SF decision to change the route is a great one for the history book. It allowed for a peaceful torch relay, peaceful protest with minimum arrests (because the torch isnt in front of some idiots with no self-control), shamed both London and Paris organizers for their incompetency in controlling crowds, and gave the world a chance to see how much support for China there is.
So if you want to boycott, go ahead. NOBODY cares. More than 160 countries in the world are definitely coming in full force. Beijing is beautiful and ready. I can’t wait personally!!!! China’s friends all over Asia, African S and Central America, even Australia and Japan and India will all be there. The US will also be there (I guarantee you Bush isnt going to take some granola crunchig white Tibetanhippie’s call for a boycott). So germany and france, and even england…stay away. Watch your airbus order go down the toilet. Those unemployed French youths who rioted a few years ago will do so again. Good luck to you. If the Europeans think they are the wrld, they are truly delusional. get your head out of your “arse”, please!
China is more united than it has ever been in its long history. Chinese-Americans have never been this proud of their ethnic motherland as now. Good job, you tibetan ‘freedom’ fighters. Now you have just guarantee that the Dalai lama wll never see his homeland again. Good job.
The tide has turned.
“typical arrogant chinese tactic”
Americans can speak out and criticize america all day and the world goes round. Chinese can speak out against China and the world goes round. But if the French speaks out against America we get constipation. Remember “Freedom Fries”. If the West speaks out against China, the Chinese will get constipation too. It’s a natural reation, nobody is perfect. If everybody would just put themselves in the other persons shoe before we speak, may the world find some peace.
To Proud Chinese-Americans
When China will become the “FIRST SUPERPOWER”, will you guys pack-up, leave USA and join your Mother-Land?
If China attacks USA, which country will you fight for?
These questions always bug me….because I don’t like people who eat our food, breath our oxygen, make money out of us but still love another country!
Why is Tibet not given the same autonomy as Hongkong?
I think that the Chinese government thinks that everything will come down to GDP/capa. When Tibet’s development reach those of Hong Kong, the government feels that the richer Tibetan will have more to loose by not being a part of China, then Tibet will find more freedom. I think the current Chinese government are more forward looking and truly wants Tibet to be fully developed. What we fear is that it may loose its grip and be replaced by the hardliners of the pasts.
If China attacks USA, which country will you fight for?
If your mother attacks your father, which one will you fight for? You would protest the war not side with any.
We are loyal tax payers too.
I believe its more important to judge a country base on it’s direction and improvements versus where it is at.
Hows the standard of living and human rights in the US compare to 10 years ago?
Hows the standard of living and human rights in Iraq compare to 10 years ago?
Hows the standard of living and human rights of Tibet compare to 10 years ago?
Hong Kong?
China?
Europe?
India?
Honestly answer these questions. Why try and stop a country that’s headed in the right direction for its people.
I honestly don’t know the living conditions in Tibet because I have never been there, at the same time I think many of the people on the Tibetan bandwagon don’t know either. Everything is base on the media, which is in business to print stories that people will buy. The majority in the West is sided with little Tibet being bullied by a big powerful Chinese government. Their minds are set and Tibetans can do no wrong.
Of course the majority of Chinese both inside China and outside China is going to support the Chinese government, whom they feel is being bullied be Super Western Powers. Their minds are set and China can do no wrong.
When you have such powerful forces at play it could be the start of a major hurricane. Thank God we have cooler heads in Beijing and Washington.
So wh0 won?
I’m glad to see abundance of intelligent, incisive, and original responses from Chinese and Chinese-Americans against the mindless recitation of sinophobic propaganda, which leads me to the following thought: I don’t know how substantiable is the notion that Asians don’t express their opinions, but the forgoing comments has shown me that when they do speak their mind it is full of substance and intellectual gravity.
Robert Mui, you are nothing but a racist and someone who would’ve supported the Japanese internment. Just because people express different views you question their loyalty to America, shame on you, you racist.
To “Robert Mui”:
“When China attacks the USA” is when you might actually have a clue.
Secondly, are those your own thoughts or are they the thoughts of your non-Chinese-American neighbor or co-worker racist bully?
Thirdly, you go through the trouble of giving a Chinese last surname - are you really Chinese or are you the low life bigot who doesn’t want to others to believe that you are Chinese?
I am just really upset by Robert Mui’s xenophobic and racist statement. It’s not YOUR food, your oxygen, or your money. It’s also our food, our oxygen and our money. Chinese Americans on average probably pay more tax than a lot of other groups in America (a claim not supported by statistics but just pure speculation) and a lot of YOUR people (whatever you are) are probably supported by OUR tax dollars, so stop being racist and condescending. As for food, a lot of YOUR people (again, whatever you are) eat a lot of Chinese American food than you’d imagine. And about loving another country, plenty of Jewish Americans love Isreal and plenty of Irish Americans love Ireland, do you want to lock us up like you did to the Japanese Americans just because some Chinese Americans have different viewpoint? Who the hell do you think you are? What gives you the right to talk down to us like you are an Americcan and we are not? You are the most un-American as someone who questions another fellow American’s loyalty based on ethnicity. You represent the worst of this country, a segment of society full of hatred and racial superiority. you got a problem you red neck ignorant racist?
To ignorant idiot Robert Mui,
How dare you to stereotype the loyalty of Chinese Americans? As someone who has family that served in the U.S. military, why do you automatically assume all Chinese American (or anyone that look Asian) are automatically foreigners? You sound like those racist white assholes who have done that in the past. Don’t ever forget what happened to Japanese Americans during WWII. This racist U.S. government did not put all German Americans and Italian Americans into intern camps but only Japanese Americans because of their race and nothing else. Don’t ever forget tens thousands of Asian Americans that gave their lives for this country.
The 442nd Regimental Combat Team of the United States Army, was an Asian American unit composed of mostly Japanese Americans who fought in Europe during the Second World War. The families of many of its soldiers were subject to internment. The 442nd was a self-sufficient fighting force, and fought with uncommon distinction in Italy, southern France, and Germany. The unit became the most highly decorated military unit in the history of the United States Armed Forces, including 21 Medal of Honor recipients, earning the nickname “The Purple Heart Battalion.” Website: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/442nd_Regimental_Combat_Team
It is one thing to disagree with other people, but it is another to go around and stereotype all Chinese Americans are the same. We are not robots, we have different opinions and thoughts like everyone else.
So FU and your racist stereotypes. How about this? If one of your sister is killing your mother, who would you want to fight for and why?
OK, I just asked a simple question and none of the CHinese Americans could give me direct answer.
Also, foreigners pay tax, paying tax does not mean you love a country.
If you are a citizen of one country, your first loyalty should go to that country.
it’s a typical racist pighead response to anything remoting intellectually challenging….
“If you are not with me, then you are a traitor”. For pete’s sake, I pay my taxes, and since the almighty Dollar is king here, I do have the right to say what I want, and do as I please, so long as I am within the bounds of law. You bet I cherish that right, and I agree that China needs to do much much more to give the same rights to its citizens. This point we dont disagree. But when it come to …”Tibet”, which by the way, is really “XIZHANG”, it is absolutely totally a part of China!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Dont muddy the water with your diversion tactics; I have a new chant for everyone here…
“One China, One tibet part of China, Get use to it”!!!!!!!!
Yes, on average, Asian Americans pay higher taxes to the US treasury because on average, the Asian Americans have higher salaries/income…even compared to the privileged white. You know why? It’s because we are not lazy,a dn we are harder working, and smarter. There was an IQ study out recently, and the East Asian countries of China, Japan and Korea all scored, on average, higher that the US, Europe and other places.
So we pay more, we have more right to speak than others. ‘nough said!
“If you are a citizen of one country, your first loyalty should go to that country.”…
So I want to see you get up first thing tomorrow and volunteer yourself for the war in Iraq. “Your” country needs you….put your life where your mouth is, buddy. Simpleton!
So, if Britain is still involved in Iraq by 2012, then should there be a boycott of the LONDON GAMES ???????????????????????????????????? Maybe there should be protests in China and all its allies to that effect….
Mike, you’re nothing but a fascist Asian supremecist, and an ignorant one at that - your English skills are in dire need of improvement. I’m shocked that the Asian Week editors published your ignorant comments, but then a lot seems to slip by them. Insofar as people “getting over” the fact that Tibet “belongs” to China, I hope you’re prepared for more violence in that region and elsewhere in China - violence that could ultimately topple the fascists who currently rule the PRC and bring down the whole house of cards that is the Chinese economy. Let’s see if you’re gloating then. The hooliganism of China’s supporters in Justin Herman Plaza yesterday demonstrated once again that they are unfit to live in a democracy and should be immediately deported to the PRC, since they obviously love dictatorship and fascist repression.
China is not the great US of A. We wish that they have our level of human rights and living standards. In reality, whether China is a Democracy with Chinese Characteristic or a Socialist with Chinese Characteristic, the same China will be challenged by stability. How China confronts this issue will effect the lives of the whole world. If China crashes, you can expect Wall Street to crash. China is not the former Soviet Union. Corporate America is heavily vested in China.
If China was Hitler Germany, all Tibetans would be force to have their head stamped, rounded up to a concentration camp and thrown in gas chambers. I don’t think China hates Tibetans, I think they just want to suppress separatist activities.
Folks:
This may well be the longest-running “string” of “commentary” for AsianWeek’s 2.0 Beta website?
And insofar as the “article” that triggered same was titled an “Asian American” take on the continuing global? saga of PRC/Tibet/Olympics urgencies, may I address my fellow Asian-Americans, to wit?
First, the “Jim Erbeses” and his likes are, simply, to me at least, literally “rabid,” as in “mad dog,” Sinophobes, but, then, that’s THEIR problem, bloodthirsty as they are..
Second, the likes of merely “ranting,” as in shouting, like both “sides” in yesterday’s finessed Justin Plaza confrontations, Sinophobes like the given-named “Eddies” (of other “strings”) and “Robs” and those merely “initial’d,” or even more cautiously pseudonymous, are querulous quidnuncs of dubyous motivations and political agendas.
Third, amidst all the hue and cry, there are sincere and logical and morally defensible positions and arguments on the part of those who sound part of the Sinophobic media bytes and bites, but most of them seem mired in the past, and to me not quite “documented,” claims of “millions” murdered in Maoist horrors.
BOTH sides are amply represented in the above, including a living “Tibetan” who WAS THERE, Charley, and a “Taiwanese” of “Chinese” ethnicity.
For the rest, folks, remember that old childhood, well, my childhood that is, jingle?
“Sticks and stones, may break my bones, but ‘names’ will never hurt me>”
That said, as one “Chinese” “American,” I’ll forego the hyphen here, who has lived and worked and pondered through nearly nine decades of “the ‘great’ American Dream,” and I am totally bemused by Art Hu’s version thereof, may I say, here and now, that I LOVE and revere MANY “whiteys,” and look askance at more than a few fellow “coloreds,” having lived with and worked with and suffered with more than enough exemplars of either side or stripe or political persuasion.
My personal take is, guys, NOT race, but, rather, the INDIVIDUAL. So down with the sweeping and totally irrelevant generalizations, and let’s get on with our individual choices and solutions, including a vote come November for the candidate who appears to offer EVERYONE the prospect of “diplomatized” regional solutions in the Mideast and the beginnings of a domestic address of festering and foundering problems of its citizens, its infrastructure, AND its very claim to the label of “democracy.”
Today?, that mild-mannered and once-denigrated as “meek” Jimmy Carter has proved to be the mensch among mice in the Beltway, opting to “meet” with Hamas, in the teeth of the Likud/AIPAC alliance with our own idiot theoneocons.
“Terrorists” are as “terrorists” do, and W is the greatest, as in most “powerful” and “destructive,” of them all, bin Laden and al-Zawahiri mere ministers to their primo, even IF their “improvised explosive devices” seem to have stalled, if not stalemated those ever-so-smart bombs of shock-and-awe.
Would that more “strangers” would visit this website, other than those uninvited and already online. Yeah, it’s their privilege and “right” of course, but, at the same time, most of us can simply skip said input from the imprimaturs.
Frank Eng
P.S.: Jim Erbes at least signs his name, but what’s your excuse, Christian? “Remember the Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution,” even with three exclamation points, is pretty louche, as in loony? You gave yourself away with your insistence on correcting Webster in the spelling of “supremEcist.”
I am a Vietnamese American and I would like to understand this issue better. I do not know anything about what is going on in China and will not pretend to know.
I do know that my former homeland Vietnam is also a Communist country and there the human rights is atrocious. It would surpise me if China’s human rights policy is any better. I also know that in Vietnam the news is propoganda and censored. I assume this is true in China as well?
I do not undersand why Chinese people are always so sensitive to criticism about China? China is a big powerful country with a proud ancient culture.
Why then do some of the chinese posters here act like the stereotypical dumb patriotic American who always defends America no matter if it is right or wrong.
Is it some sort of inferiority complex because of China history of being humiliated by Britain, Japan, France..?
Anyway… I think that people are people, American, Chinese, French, Tibetan, Vietnamese.. we all want to live peacefully and raise our family and contribute to the good of society. Peace!
Dear Peter Duong:
You, young man, and I believe I can thus address you purely from the vantage point of age, not that that guarantees anything other than time, are absolutley RIGHT, as in “correct.”
From your vantage point, that is.
Perhaps it may be of help if you consulted your fellow countryman?, Arthur Hu, as to HIS experience and “understanding” of both the old “homeland” and the new.
Your perception of “Communist” propaganda and controlled “press” may well be accurate, but have you the faintest idea of just how “propagandistic” and equally if not more “controlled” the American “media” are today?
I can tell you, as a “professional,” at one time anyway, “journalist” that what is promulgated, what is perceived and what is believed is more often than not, Bah, humbug!
On both sides of this divide of interests and agendas and persuasions.
The PRC multimillions, of people that is, have had a longer gestation period, and, today, it would seem, has evolved into a “socialist” version of “rich-is-good” semantics, a quasi-Marxist, commie-haters and -baiters notwithstanding, “state” and governance.
The running-dog capitalists of the West, hey!, they’re as entitled to epithets are they not?, in view of the “Opium War” and the 19th-Century “spheres of influence” and “partitioning” of the Mainland into Russo/German/British/American zones that included a Shanghai “International Settlement” island whose “park” posted a sign at the gate that proclaimed “No dogs or Chinese allowed.” Please note the “second billing” of natives here.
And this does not even begin to address the issue of “extraterritorial” rights and privileges of invaders and occupiers. Can you venture a glimpse of slant-eyed types proclaiming Avalon “extraterritorial” and verboten to Americans unless they were hired help, like coolies and wetbacks and “niggers”?
No, Peter Duong, it is NOT an “inferiority complex,” have you not noted the strident charges of “arrogance” and subhumanity in one and the same breath of much of the foregoing? It is the centuries-long assumption of “uperiority” of the Western “Brahmin,” the self-anointed purveyors of “civilization” to the “lesser breeds without the ‘law’.” of that eminent poetaster Rudyard Kipling.
I have of late, and assuredly far too belatedly, been reading a few of the “biographies” of that late, lamented, and absolutely delightful Sir Richard Burton, no, not Liz’s hubby, the swaggering soldier, adventurer, explorer, ethnographer, student, scholar, poet, AND venturer int0 the demimonde of the forbidden of his day, the inquisitor and chronicler of both language and custom, sexuality and sensuality, of Arab and Sufi and tribal and colonial confluences.
Our present-day “leaders” and peers could do worse than to reexamine said worthy’s books, along with the record and reports of one “Lawrence of Arabia” in re our current dilemmas in Ira
Dear Peter Duong:
You, young man, and I believe I can thus address you purely from the vantage point of age, not that that guarantees anything other than time, are absolutely RIGHT, as in “correct.”
From your vantage point, that is.
Perhaps it may be of help if you consulted your fellow countryman?, Arthur Hu, as to HIS experience and “understanding” of both the old “homeland” and the new.
Your perception of “Communist” propaganda and controlled “press” may well be accurate, but have you the faintest idea of just how “propagandistic” and equally if not more “controlled” the American “media” are today?
I can tell you, as a “professional,” at one time anyway, “journalist” that what is promulgated, what is perceived and what is believed is more often than not, Bah, humbug!
On both sides of this divide of interests and agendas and persuasions.
The PRC multimillions, of people that is, have had a longer gestation period, and, today, it would seem, has evolved into a “socialist” version of “rich-is-good” semantics, a quasi-Marxist, commie-haters and -baiters notwithstanding, “state” and governance.
The running-dog capitalists of the West, hey!, they’re as entitled to epithets are they not?, in view of the “Opium War” and the 19th-Century “spheres of influence” and “partitioning” of the Mainland into Russo/German/British/American zones that included a Shanghai “International Settlement” island whose “park” posted a sign at the gate that proclaimed “No dogs or Chinese allowed.” Please note the “second billing” of natives here.
And this does not even begin to address the issue of “extraterritorial” rights and privileges of invaders and occupiers. Can you venture a glimpse of slant-eyed types proclaiming Avalon “extraterritorial” and verboten to Americans unless they were hired help, like coolies and wetbacks and “niggers”?
No, Peter Duong, it is NOT an “inferiority complex,” have you not noted the strident charges of “arrogance” and subhumanity in one and the same breath of much of the foregoing? It is the centuries-long assumption of “uperiority” of the Western “Brahmin,” the self-anointed purveyors of “civilization” to the “lesser breeds without the ‘law’.” of that eminent poetaster Rudyard Kipling.
I have of late, and assuredly far too belatedly, been reading a few of the “biographies” of that late, lamented, and absolutely delightful Sir Richard Burton, no, not Liz’s hubby, the swaggering soldier, adventurer, explorer, ethnographer, student, scholar, poet, AND venturer int0 the demimonde of the forbidden of his day, the inquisitor and chronicler of both language and custom, sexuality and sensuality, of Arab and Sufi and tribal and colonial confluences.
Our present-day “leaders” and peers could do worse than to reexamine said worthy’s books, along with the record and reports of one “Lawrence of Arabia” in re our current dilemmas in Iraq and Afghanistan, even more particularly in Palestine, and not that far off from Darfur as well.
Tibet? Well, I, for one, have learned more than a few “facts” and “charges” in these columns and comments, and whereas I, too, yearn for international cooperation and “peace,” I would, young man, question “the Man” here as to an unwinnable war and an idiot projection of a truly “superiority”-complexed lot of jackanapes juveys who should be ridden out of the Beltway, with or without tar and feathers, preferably with.
Frank Eng
P.S.: Do I sound as if I suffer an “inferiority complex”? If I do so, chalk it up to my “Amerricanization” by birth.
Mad about Tibet
So now, the Dalai Lama says, rather meekly and after the fact, that he is “saddened” by the torch protesters and that he actually supports the Olympics and is not anti-Chinese. Where was he before London and Paris? Did he not have a hand in fomenting such violent emotions? Is he not the leader of the Tibetan people? Or is it all just media play?
I suspect the popularity of Tibetan Buddhism in the West was promoted over the last couple of decades for political purposes, just as the Dalai Lama and his predecessors have always been political, as well as, spiritual leaders. Tibet is not, and has never been, a spiritual shangri-la. Certainly, the behavior of the pro-Tibet protesters last week lay bare the lie that these people are a bunch of peaceful, non-violent victims.
I was on the Embarcadero last Wednesday. I went to support the Olympics and to stand peacefully in solidarity with my fellow Chinese and Chinese-Americans who feel that China has been unfairly and expediently demonized. The Chinese people have suffered from colonial and imperialist oppression, just as the Tibetans claim to be suffering now. We have struggled over a century for the kind of respect that is being shown by awarding the Olympics to us. If you have no consideration for us why should we care about you? It is preposterous and disingenuous to use that old, worn-out cliche that “we are against the Chinese government, not the Chinese people.” When you scream, “China, liar” to my face, were you somehow mistaking me for the government?
If the behavior of these demonstrators were any indication of where the “Free Tibet” movement is headed, I’d say it’s headed for disaster. Whatever moral authority they claim was relinquished as they succumbed to the irresistible slide into clinging, delusion and ego gratification: “I am right, you are wrong. I am good, you are bad. My cause is more important than anything else. I am the victim, you are the oppressor. I can out-shout you.” Very non-Buddhist-like behavior on the part of supposedly a Buddhist people.
The sloganeering, the rhetoric and mob mentality came off all too familiar to one who has been to demonstrations of one kind or another since the early 70s. What was reported as a peaceful event was anything but. While it’s true that there was very little physical violence, the level of emotional and psychological violence that I witnessed was both sad and frightening. It is precisely this kind of violent mind set that leads inevitably disaster. It sets off a karmic chain reaction that is unstoppable. Once you decide to taunt the tiger, you should expect to be mauled. By then, it would be too late to retreat to moral high ground.
Sad thing is, this type of tragedy has already been played out so many times in history - India/Pakistan, the former Yugoslavia, Rwanda, etc., etc. In each case, complex relationships were reduced to black and white. Battle lines were drawn - created either through propaganda or by fabricated events, i.e., unspeakable acts of violence and terror - so that no one could remain neutral. All choices are reduced to one: us or them. Neighbors, friends, husbands, wives - all were forced to choose and act in ways they normally would be ashamed to.
On a much smaller scale, I too had to choose. I went to the Embarcadero support the Olympics and China, but I also had sympathy toward the plight of the Tibetan people. I went in peace, but it quickly became clear that there was no room for such fine feelings. The situation, created by the hostility and belligerence of the pro-Tibet and other protesters, made it very clear that one had to be on one side or the other. Faced with that, I made my choice. When I saw a lone, flag waving Chinese student who was quickly becoming overwhelmed by a crazed mob, I climbed over the barricade and lent him a hand. For what it was worth, at that moment, the “Free Tibet” movement lost another supporter.
For those who smugly claimed to have “won” the day because they succeeded in diverting the Torch run, I say, enjoy your delusion while you can. You haven’t won anything, least of all any good for the Tibetan people. Blood will be shed in Tibet. The bloodletting will most likely take place after the Olympics, when the fickle media will turn its attention elsewhere - or, more likely, be prevented from covering it. The June 4 Massacre will pale in comparison.
The most tragic part of this is that the blood will be shed in vain. Tibet will not be free. By then all those well-meaning, guilt-ridden, know-it-all/know-nothing, missionaries, who now feel so ennobled shouting slogans, will not be able to help. Instead they will safe in their homes in the West. For those who are truly sincere, they will have to live with the guilt for their role in contributing to the slide toward catastrophe. And they will feel spiritually emptier than ever, as their icons fall.
Lastly, I wonder, for all those who shout “Free Tibet” so self-righteously, do they have any idea what form a free Tibet will take? If the Chinese packed their bags today, is there a provisional government standing by to take over? Will it include all different sectors and factions of Tibetans? Or will Tibet balkanize or become like another Iraq? What will happen to the Han Chinese living in Tibet? Will there be ethnic cleansing? Will there be a democratic government or will Tibet revert to a male-dominated theocracy? How will human rights fare then? Could a Taliban-like equivalent emerge? Will India, Russia, other nearby countries keep their fingers out of the pie? How will Tibet survive in an economy now propped up by the Chinese government? As for “cultural genocide” - please! Enough hyperbole already. It’s called modernization. All traditional societies have had to face the awful, awesome reality of history: adapt or die. Don’t blame others for your own clinging.
* * *
By the way, I fully support Mayor Gavin Newsom’s decision. He had a job to do and he did it. As a proud San Franciscan, I did not want a repeat of London or Paris in my city. That was shameful. As for all you spoiled brat whiners out there - you knew full well, ahead of time, that all of us faced the possibility of missing the torch. You knew what the situation was and WHO was responsible for messing it up in the first place. Finally - did you ever think of the safety and dignity of the Olympic athletes? Just cut the rhetoric and tantrums! GROW UP!
Leon Sun
April 11, 2008
If China was a super power, it would have given India and ultimatum to hand over Dalai Lama or face invasion.
It would have given Bin Laden a congressional metal of honor for his work in trying to peacefully liberate the Arab world from Western Powers.
Below is modified from a comment I posted on Sfgate.com
A Gangster-turned-Christian apparently is trying to convert another Gangster, here is their dialogue:
Christian: You gangster is doing all bad things no good! You got to convert in order to save your soul.
Gangster: What you are saying about me isn’t entirely true. More truth will come out.
Christian: The whole world believes what I say.
Gangster: That’s because you control the world. However, even if what you are saying about me is true, you still can’t preach to me like this.
Christian: Why not?
Gangster: You were worse regarding what you did to that red Indian girl and that black boy. You were a white colonist and a slave owner.
Christian: That doesn’t count. It was only in the past.
Gangster: But the descendants of that red Indian girl still go out to protest on your birthday every July 4th.
Christian: Precisely! That shows they are free!
Gangster: You seem very forgetful and self-forgiving. Well, you are still doing the same, see what you are doing to that Iraqi girl. You are an invader and a war profiteer.
Christian: That is different. It isn’t about me, it is about you, you!
Gangster: That seems very indifferent of you. And I must say that you are unreasonably self-rightious.
Christian: Shut up! God speaks to me! You don’t do what I say, I am going to boycott your f**king Olympics!
Gangster: ……Wait a minute……Gosh! Be respectful to yourself! man… the Olympics is yours! It is your tradition, I am hosting it for you to spread your culture. YOUR culture!
Christian: Mine is universal! Serving my universals is your honor! Failing it is your shame!
Gangster: So if a westerner hosting a Chinese New Year Parade, for whatever reason a Chinese guy doesn’t like that westerner and goes up to him and pulls his pants off in public, you think it is the westerner’s shame?!
Christian: Yes, because he is embarrassed!
Gangster: This is stupid. Well, It is the westerner’s embarrassment, but it is the Chinese guy’s shame! For sure, that poor westerner is not going to host the Chinese New Year Parade again. Whose loss is it?! Pants pulling the Olympics, yes, my embarrassement, yet your shame! Don’t you get that?!
Christian: It is your shame! your shame! I insist!
Gangster: This is only the logic of a pants puller. Only un-cultured, confused, unintelligent, rude people would think and act that way. You seem very arrogant too. I used to worry how I could catch your guys up, but if this is the character and quality of your men, I am no more worried. Your men are no match of my men! You are no match of me!
First off, I agree with those saying that the people calling for boycotts and protests are pointless. The Olympic committee never should have allowed China to host the Olympics to begin with, but now that that is where they are going to be, a bunch of hippies parading around the streets of SF is going to do much.
This is the first time I’ve visited this site (and yes, I am a Chinese American - born here in the good ol’ USA). I have to say I’m very underwhelmed by the reasoning in this editorial. From my experience, Americans are pretty good at separating Chinese Americans from the communist dictators over there in China.
The commenters who try to pull the moral relativism bs make me laugh…if you are trying to compare China to the US in terms of human rights abuses you clearly don’t have your brain screwed in tight. You idiots are posting on this site aren’t you? You think you’d have the ability to criticize the Chinese communist government if you were living in China??? I dare those people who claim the US has “no right” to care about human rights violations because we are “just as bad” to go to China and complain about the government and see what happens to them…..
The chinese communist government did a great job to the Han population within the last 50 years.As a result,now china is the greatest economic superpower in the world.It can say” no”to any one .Please compare this situation with that of 100 years ago(the whole chinese army was so humiliated by the so called “multinational force “of just 2000 soldiers.So I don’t agree with the overseas “anti-china” chinese.Chinese people don’t need too much democracy. Still what most of them need is food and clean drink.
Unfortunately,the chinese government did many bad things to the minorities.It force them to abondon their own language,their culture,use their natural resources without any payment.
most of the minorities ,speacially like Tibet,Oiughuer,Mongols,they are living on their own land
without equal treatment.
Of course,they don’t have the power to do anything against the strong China.But,please remember,God is there watching.He gave you china this power because you suffered alot in your long history.You were treated unhumanly by the Mongols,Huns,Mans,Japanese,europeon…….
So god is giving you this power to see how you use it.Don’t kill these weak minorities .You can hide it anyway.
Please believe in God;Don’t forget what the 3 million jews in Israel are doing to the 300 million arabs.Peace and food is needed everywhere.
I strongly support those that are protesting. Obviously, it will make China think about things if there are several countries not participating in the Olympics. I don’t believe that what they are doing is right whatsoever, and I think that they need to let Tibet be their own people, since they clearly already think like individuals.
I support Tibet and their actions 110%!!!!
The following article about who are the root of all world trouble and think about it. Make your own judgement.
West is ‘waging a new Cold War against China’
(Xinhua)
Updated: 2008-04-17 06:52
BERLIN: A German politician has accused Western countries of waging a “new Cold War” against China as a prominent China expert in Germany deplored the West’s demonization of the country.
“Every generation seems to need its own war before it is capable and wise enough to draw lessons from that, be it a hot war or a cold war,” Antje Vollmer, a former vice-president of the German parliament, wrote in an article published in the German daily Sueddeutsche Zeitung on Tuesday.
“It took barely 10 years after the end of the last Cold War before a new hot war was declared - the war on terror,” she said.
“Can the war on terror be won with weapons?” Vollmer asked. Her answer was “No”.
“At a time when we are already in an ideological confrontation with Islamic and Arab countries, at a time when we have maneuvered ourselves into a sort of diplomatic confrontation with Russia, now again a general system confrontation with China? Every fifth person in the world is Chinese. Obviously the West has too much self confidence,” said Vollmer.
Meanwhile, Thomas Heberer, a leading China expert in Germany, accused the West of “demonizing” China in an article published yesterday in the German daily Die Tageszeitung.
“After the idolization of the 1990s, we are now at a stage of demonization,” Heberer said.
“This is partly due to the rise of China and the associated false fears that China could become an economic and political threat to the West.
“What is especially fatal is that the huge successes and changes in the course of China’s reform policy since the late 1970s are now forgotten.”
He also pointed out that the real causes and background of the Tibet issue are not understood by the West.
“No country in the world has ever recognized the independence of Tibet or declared that Tibet is an ‘occupied country’. For all countries in the world, Tibet is Chinese territory,” he said.
Dear Joyce:
No quarrel with your feelings and beliefs about our “good ol’ ” U.S. of A.
But, and this is a major “but,” and, actually, has no direct connection with the brouhaha over the Beijing Olympics and Tibet –
This selfsame, “your”?, not mine, I prefer the U.S. of George McGovern and Jimmy Carter today, is sadly and almost solely, include here Blair’s Britain, for the obscene and insufferable debacle this administration still insists if moral AND “winnable.”
Let America take the first step to right this incredible wrong in Iraq first, and the upcoming election may well be that first step, then come back and tell me to celebrate “our,” yours AND mine, happy and comfy coexistences in this obviously fractured and infighting nation, the richest and the most technologically advance “civilization” in the millennial “history” of humankind on this earth.
Frank Eng
P.S.: Wish I could “laugh” with you.
Joyce,
We can blog and criticize China all we want here. Don’t think that you can just go out and criticize the USA all you want though. Maybe if you are white. Look what happens to pastor Wright. He made a few comments about racial inequality in this country and was practically crucifide by the media. He did not even burn down white churches. Yet Western media is siding with a group of Tibetans that are actually racists. Selecting and burning down namely Han and Muslim businesses.
Yes we have it good in this country. China is not the US. The situation in Tibet is like Iraq. Lots of ethnic tension. The whole world is telling the US to withdraw troops, but I don’t think that is the answer either, or the country will collapse into total chaos. At the same time, the West is telling China not to crack down on Tibetans. I don’t think they can stand by and let Tibet collapse into total chaos either.
I don’t think the Chinese in general has a problem with the West’s criticism of Chinas Human Rights. It’s definitely not the first time they heard about it. The problem is the frequency and tone used. The constant bashing of problems that are common place in this world.
The stories that are blown out of proportions to make an “in your face” statements. The condescending statements by Western governments as if the Chinese government no longer can govern and maybe G-8 can split the country into 8 pieces. If you don’t know where this is leading to, maybe you’re are naive or I am too skeptical.
Do you know that Saudi Arabia is a dictator with some of the worst case of human rights abuse on this planet? The Saudis are our friends. Shouldn’t we try and help change our friends before trying to help someone who does not appreciate our help? They get red carpet welcomes in all Western countries.
As a Chinese, we have swallowed our prides countless times before. There is no doubt we can accept criticism. We must also be smart enough to know when we are being singled out and the crititcisms are disproportionate.
Huang Fong,
You presented some very good points. And I agree with you completely.
As Chinese, we can’t allow the West to control and manipulate us. We have to see their ultimate motivations behind their actions. Chinese should stand up for ourselves no matter what. The West can only use media and other soft tactics to attack China — that is about it.
Having been in the US for over ten years, I can understand how the US
The following article is the continuation of the above unfinished article.
Having been in the US for over ten years, I can undersand how the US and its Western allies are playing its game in the world. What kinds of tricks they are using.
China should do what is the best for China no matter what others say. Just do it. Don’t be afraid of any nation. Build China into a economic super power of the world. I think that this is the best way.
In the meantime, the West will be rotted and decayed. Let them play the uncontrolled game of democracy and freedom.
to all of those that say china is a wonderful place, you’re probable right. At the same time you shouldn’t contend western ideals with undermuning of chinese thinking. The fact is that we’re tied to each other economically and we should make the best of it. But if you don’t by 2050 the arms buildup will look like three cold wars and the ‘hot’ was will bring upom unimaginable distruction. The funny part is the there will be so few people left on earth though that the only political system that will matter are chiefs. But at least the white anglo saxon irish germab frenvh hippy conservative nancy pelosi republican nazi kkk anti communitist cracker is also, by definition and chinese because the qing empire came just at the same time as communism. Hey morons, of all races, if you’re not a moron pay no attention, but if you didn’t know that communism was a western ideal, well now you do. O and abother thing towards the republicans, i’m a white jew, but i think the ground war in the middle east is complet
as i was saying, this isn’t racism but there are literally so many chinese that they could make (estimate) ten rows deep of people from the south tip of alaska to the bottom portion of the world. Also just because the white machine is country doesn’t mean you have the right allow. Start blowing uoi factories. Don’t be afraid be strong. I’d be pissed to if my proud country experienced 400 years of uniterrupted rape. O wait i’m an irish jew i’ve had total 6,000 years. Well who’s counting. Also, quit comparing yourselves to african americans, and in the same fashion african americans do. You’re whole angry chinese is upnxious and out of style. Guess what you r the 2nd superpower, in population, industry, and output of resources and manufactured goods. And you know what capitalism is the best form of financing we got. But sociallized capitalism is even better. Why doesn’t china try that for sides. And also, china, if you decide to revolt against your government, the world will support you. And if not you
Folks:
Stream-of-consciousness is actually a legit literary form, and, by the bye, institutionalized by an Irishman at that, but “mike stipe” stumps me. You too?
But there also appear to be a few fractured grains, kernels?, of substance and relevance, that is, if I reac and “understand” aright.
His claim this nation and China are “tied” to one another economically ix more than obvious, and I, for one, have long harbored the hope that said “tie” that binds will prove to trump the divisive, warmongering theoneocons now still in charge in the Beltway.
But his 2050 scenario and road-warriors script pursuant has much less to do with any Mainland arms buildup, maybe space shots?, than with the continuing reign of Yankee “hawks” and superpatriot gospel-spouting mercenaries of one class, stripe, or another.
Today’s running serial on Mainland telescreens attests to the fact that the cadres are, indeed, walking their talk, or at the very least, making a manly effort. Compare the feeble and futile FEMA efforts post-Katrina.
The “Central Flowery Kingdom” has historically and epochally demonstrated its “inward” focus, note well the Ming explorer who, before the European colonialists, DID leave behind “suzerainties” but NO colonies in his globe[-girdling, well, a goodly part of it, naval adventurings.
It’s “our,” yours and mine, mike stipe, government that is the inciter, instigator, AND promulgater of global strife and destabilizations. There’s an online piece TODAY in the London Guardian that posits the theory that Chile will know no domestic calm until the Pincohet era is brought to heel, in court, and before God and Everyman.
And was our CIA not a chief culprit therein?
No, “Tibet” and its god-king, among several>, the personalbe and saintly? Dalai Lama, who numbers among his friends not only Richard Gere but a blonde sex goddess who apparently equates friendship with the sufferings of millions, are not even sidebars here, and the Olympics, truly and merely, “games” juveniles play.
And in the long and treacherous, not to mention arduous, path trod by humankind, for sure Marx, and Engels?, forged and focussed the theme of the communal, but, as with every valid and important human concept, the “credit” and the authorship is likely beholden to many forebears.
Socialism, of course, is the user-friendly and bourgeois dilution of a brew too heady and too logical for most, certainly the many amongst the privileged and the powerful.
And, as dramatically and cinematically evinced in one other “movie,” Warren Beatty’s “Reds,” it is human nature that ultimately trumps all else, whatever the theory or the syistem or the superstructures or lack thereof.
Compare the performance of the cadreses’ leaders, on camera or off, in the Sichuan quake and aftermath to that of our dubyous “president” and his minions post-Karina.
And next to the understated and serene presence of an Iranian ayiatollah in the UN, Bush’s performance indeed merited Hugo Chavezes taunts and jeers.
So, the immediate question has little, if anything, to do with these kitetails of fluttering prayer flags in the ethers of cyberspace, it has only to do with a vote here, a superdelegate there, and, maybe, just maybe, the outcome of one more election in a vaunted “democracy” of “equals,” some more and some less. Equal, that is.
Frank Eng
P.S.: michael, belay the idiot notion of numbers, as in row-upon-row. A single child who tells his rescuers, no, rescue my classmates first, is paramount. To ALL of us.
The owner of Asian Week is the Son in law of one of the Chinese communist political committee of China, so that is the reason